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Author Topic: X-files= dead!  (Read 7780 times)
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cyber_turnip

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« Reply #200 on: 07-14-2015 13:44 »

I've nearly finished season 6 now and, whilst it's taken a bit of a dip in the back-half, the step up in quality compared to seasons 1-5 is just insane. It's almost like a completely different show.

Season 6 is definitely my favourite so far. Sadly, I understadn that 7, onwards, is where it starts to go to pot.
Tachyon

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« Reply #201 on: 07-14-2015 17:35 »


Beauty is in the eye of the beholder: maybe you'll enjoy the later seasons more than did the critics smile

Then, when you've finished, I'll query you on whether I ought to see it some time, as I've never watched even a single episode of the X-files.

winna

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« Reply #202 on: 07-14-2015 18:23 »

I like seasons 1-3.  If you like the 90s, it's evocative of that.
JoshTheater

Space Pope
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« Reply #203 on: 07-14-2015 22:08 »

I currently started watching again at the point where I was in season 5. I really enjoyed seasons 2-4, but felt that season 5 started to dip in quality, which was partly the reason I stopped watching for a while. The other reason is that the author of those episodic comics that were posted on the previous page of this thread took a maternal hiatus after she finished season 4's episodes, and I was waiting for her to return from it. Unfortunately, she never did, and instead started a Patreon where she set the return of the comic as one of the milestones that could be reached with enough donations...unfortunately, her total backing hasn't really even approached that milestone yet. I'm guessing that maybe this means she doesn't have that much desire to continue the comic, which is sad.

Anyway, I'd never heard that season 6 was supposedly so much better than what came before, so that gives me incentive to truck on forward through the series, I guess.
winna

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« Reply #204 on: 07-15-2015 05:03 »

Season 8 is the best, until season 9 came out.
totalnerd undercanada

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« Reply #205 on: 07-15-2015 06:33 »

Season 6 is pretty decent, really. But for me it marks the start of a decline that began very gradually and slid down rapidly as it approached the end (with an uptick towards that end).

Seasons 1-5 were alternately goofy, and dark. They had a balance to them (particularly 2-4) that later seasons just don't seem to replicate. Even though some of the best episodes are in 6 and 7, they just fall flatter as overall seasons (potentially this is due to the mytharc stuff just taking weirder and stupider twists as it evolved) and don't approach the overall cohesion and balanced tone of the previous offerings.

As sad as it is to say, The X-Files later seasons are a product of their time, I think. The whose series feels a little dated now (especially when they make phone calls with those 90s handsets). The earlier seasons suffer a little from this, but also have that feeling of being a little outside of a clear time period. There's a lot that still holds up and doesn't have as much of that "90s TV" feel to it.

Much of it does, of course. But enough of the seasons before the movie feel like they could be taking place now with only slight upgrades to their mobile telephones being required for it.

That's one thing that I feel really helps the quality of the earlier seasons hold up today, and the later seasons feel a lot more anchored to the 90s. Which might be a reason why I'm not as fond of them overall, even though they contain some outstanding episodes.
AdrenalinDragon

Starship Captain
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« Reply #206 on: 07-15-2015 17:31 »

How did you feel about the Mulder-less seasons totalnerduk? I've seen people say Season 8 is an improvement over 6 and 7 due to the episodes being more like 1-5. Come to think of it, I don't remember Season 8 having any comedy episodes at all.
totalnerd undercanada

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« Reply #207 on: 07-15-2015 17:40 »

How did you feel about the Mulder-less seasons totalnerduk?

The same way I felt about Stargate SG-1 without Daniel Jackson. Or without Jack O'Neill. Or without Don S. Davis; it just wasn't the same. Sometimes that difference was a good thing, sometimes it was a bad one. But overall, it felt like the show had changed, and that was something that caused a subtle level of disconnection. The characters I'd gotten to know had departed, and here I was, expected to get to know somebody else.

It wasn't the same. That's not intended as a criticism, just an observation - I enjoyed the dynamic of the X-files as it began immensely. I enjoyed the show in general even without Mulder. But I think that I'd have enjoyed the seasons without him more if they hadn't been without him.

That's not much of an answer, is it? Sorry about that. But I stand by my non-answer of "they weren't the same". It's the best answer I can give.

winna

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« Reply #208 on: 07-15-2015 21:20 »

I also feel they did a poor job of convincing you you wanted to get to know the new character(s).  Pile on top of this the bizarre way they handle mulder being gone or not being gone.  The earlier seasons are character driven, and to me there was a solid foundation with Mulder, Scully and the rest ( all here on Mulder's island ).  Arguably, had the show gone on, the writers would have found a groove with the new characters (it seemed like they were slowly getting better) but as it was, it was too little too late. 

To sum up, they expected the audience to have an emotional investment in the new characters, but the characters themselves didn't seem to have a solid foundation in the framework of the show to warrant that investment.

I'll also throw this out there: the scifi writing in those later episodes also felt weaker, and this is even taking into conaideration that the earlier episodes have become outdated due to technological advancements.  As an example, Ghost in the Machine (season 1 I think maybe 2) is still fun to watch, even though most of the techno babble and actions people took seems downright absurd to most of society now precisely because computers have become more mainstream and people in general seem to understand them better.  The premise and motivations in the episode, however, still hold up better 20 years later than the silly things displayed in late season episodes.
cyber_turnip

Urban Legend
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« Reply #209 on: 07-16-2015 21:33 »

It's getting really annoying how, in pretty much every episode, Scully says something like "Mulder, aliens don't exist" even though, at this point, she's encountered irrefutable proof that they exist about 53 times.

I just watched that snakes episode and Mulder was making fun of people believing in religious stuff and she pointed out that it's no different to believing in flying saucers despite the fact that they both witnessed a flying saucer in close-range action at the end of the first movie; not to mention all their other run-ins with aliens and ghosts and so forth. By this point in the series, you'd expect her to be as much of a believer as Mulder.
AdrenalinDragon

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« Reply #210 on: 07-17-2015 14:01 »

It's getting really annoying how, in pretty much every episode, Scully says something like "Mulder, aliens don't exist" even though, at this point, she's encountered irrefutable proof that they exist about 53 times.

I just watched that snakes episode and Mulder was making fun of people believing in religious stuff and she pointed out that it's no different to believing in flying saucers despite the fact that they both witnessed a flying saucer in close-range action at the end of the first movie; not to mention all their other run-ins with aliens and ghosts and so forth. By this point in the series, you'd expect her to be as much of a believer as Mulder.

These issues are both covered in Season 8 if I'm correct.
JoshTheater

Space Pope
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« Reply #211 on: 07-17-2015 20:11 »
« Last Edit on: 07-17-2015 20:19 »

Eight seasons in is way too late to address an issue that had been consistently prevalent since at least season 2. In fact, I'd even pinpoint the episode Ghost In The Machine (the seventh of the whole series, from season 1) that winna mentioned earlier as being a point after which Scully realistically had no right raising her nose at any supernatural possibilities, let alone alien life.

It's just one of those things you kind of accept as a trademark contradiction of the series and roll with if you plan to enjoy the show for what it offers. To be fair, there are lots of episodes where the writers don't have Scully necessarily outright deny the possibility of supernatural occurences, but rather simply seek to rule out any and all logical explanations first -- as opposed to Mulder who usually, with some exception, wants to jump to the supernatural conclusion first. It's a much smarter way that the show often utilizes Scully, but inconsistently so.
winna

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« Reply #212 on: 07-18-2015 01:24 »

It's more noticeable binge watching the show.  I end up pointing it out when I watch it now, and it's basically worth a few laughs (ref comic on previous page).

That said, the show operated because none of the charactera were actually people; Mudler and Sullcy are really just archetypes (supernatural + science respectably) as are the rest of the characters, Skinner (hard boss veteran), CSM (secret gov interests), and Lone Gunmen (comp nerds).  This was a successful formula when the show was airing on a weekly basis because you could drop in on any given episode and understand the situation within 10 min before your first commercial break.  It's absurd when compared with reality, but it also gives the audience an opportunity to put themselves in the place of the characters (everyone wants to be Muldar).  By season seven though those archetypes were changing, and that did a lot of damage (imo) to the balance of the show.  Yes, Scully should have acknowledged the existence of space aliens and gov conspiracies after the pilot, but that would've taken the push and pull away from a lot of the show's plots.  It's better if you consider most episodes (especially MotW) as self contained murder mysteries.  The first act sets the plot, the second leads us down one path (in a seemingly reasonable way), then the third act throws a twist and concludes the events.  Not all plota followed this formula exactly, but I thought a lot of episodes did a good job of distracting the viewer before performing a good magic trick, even knowing the trick, I still enjoy watching a lot of those episodes ( Die Hand die Verletzt ).

Also noteworthy is the fact that almost nothing Sculder and Mully do are or were realistic.  They almost never applied for warrants, and basically performed illegal searches and huge wastes of funds to solve mysteries in which no one was ever prosecuted.  Mulder basically had an infinite license and fbi account to run around the country for shits and giggles while Scully tagged along.  Even though it wasn't realistic, it was fun, and a few times the show pointed out these inaccuracies ( which was funny ).  One time they got asked for a warrant, then broke into the building later that night; for some reason they were also both adept at breaking locks and had lock picking equipment on them.  Hell, in one episode an fbi director has to talk to Scully because Meldur wants to open a case because of something he read in a tabloid (the case gets open and they investigate, in case you were wondering).
totalnerd undercanada

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« Reply #213 on: 07-18-2015 02:15 »

It's more noticeable binge watching the show.

You can never just watch one episode...

Quote
That said, the show operated because ... the character were ... just archetypes

A formula used to great success by Shakespeare, George Lucas, and J. K. Rowling. This is what sets good fiction apart from bad fiction - smart use of a formula which you don't notice is a formula until you're halfway through and are invested enough in the story to appreciate the trope rather than have it wreck the suspension of your disbelief from the start.

Quote
(everyone wants to be Muldar)

If I had to pick a character/archetype, I'd rather not be the crazy guy who's constantly talking about aliens. He might be smooth as fuck, but Mulder is pretty loopy (although he's often right, so I suppose that it's justified within the show's internal framework). Not everybody wants to be Mulder. I'd rather be Scully, Skinner, or even one of the Lone Gunmen. They all have more interesting character arcs than Mr. Crazy himself. Overall though, I'm just glad that I'm not any of them. I wouldn't want to go through what they do in order to develop as characters or archetypes. Especially Scully's whole alien kidnapping deal.

Quote
I thought a lot of episodes did a good job of distracting the viewer before performing a good magic trick, even knowing the trick, I still enjoy watching a lot of those episodes ( Die Hand die Verletzt ).

Absolutely. A good trick is still entertaining even when you know how it works, and some episodes are well-written enough that even knowing the tropes employed by the episode and the series as a whole, even knowing that they were written to a formula and feature archetypes rather than people, you can still be pulled into the episode and enjoy them just as much the hundredth time around as the first and second. The episode you mentioned is definitely just such an episode.

Quote
Also noteworthy is the fact that almost nothing Sculder and Mully do are or were realistic.

Almost any film or TV series featuring high-level police work of some kind does this same thing though. That's another stock trope of not just the series but the entire genre of investigative/thriller/mystery shows.

It's getting really annoying how, in pretty much every episode, Scully says something like "Mulder, aliens don't exist" even though, at this point, she's encountered irrefutable proof that they exist about 53 times.

There's one episode in Season Three if I'm remembering right where she comes up with the crazy theories and Mulder's the one stubbornly clinging to logic in the face of the mounting evidence. It's a pretty good one. It's the one with cockroaches, I think.
JoshTheater

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« Reply #214 on: 07-18-2015 02:37 »

War of the Coprophages. From what I can tell it's the least-appreciated episode written by Darin Morgan in the view of the fanbase (in favor of great episodes like Clyde Bruckman or Jose Chung) but it's my personal favorite of his easily. Very subversive and funny.
winna

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« Reply #215 on: 07-18-2015 20:30 »
« Last Edit on: 07-18-2015 22:46 »

What'd you say her name was Meldar?  Dr. Bambi!?

Edit: season 3 is probably my favorite, including that episode.  The kids make a reappearance later, and I enjoyed all of the off hand drug references in that episode. That season also self contains the Quequag story arc.
AdrenalinDragon

Starship Captain
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« Reply #216 on: 07-19-2015 03:39 »

I'm curious to see what cyber_turnip puts as his top 10 X-Files episodes from Season 1-7.
cyber_turnip

Urban Legend
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« Reply #217 on: 07-19-2015 16:25 »

I've just started season 8 and so far, so good. That said, Mulder's still in these episodes so far, so maybe that's something to do with it.

Top 10 episodes of seasons 1-7:
10. Drive
9. Mind's Eye
8. X-Cops
7. How the Ghosts Stole Christmas
6. Our Town
5. Terms of Endearment
4. The Amazing Maleeni
3. Dreamland
2. Bad Blood
1. Paper Hearts
JoshTheater

Space Pope
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« Reply #218 on: 07-19-2015 17:32 »

There's nothing from seasons 1-3 on that list, eh?
cyber_turnip

Urban Legend
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« Reply #219 on: 07-19-2015 21:30 »

"Our Town" is season 2, but I think that's it.

Seasons 5-7 are definitely the best seasons of the show in my opinion.
winna

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« Reply #220 on: 07-19-2015 23:32 »
« Last Edit on: 07-19-2015 23:34 »

I don't know whether I'm surprised or disappointed that 'First Person Shooter' doesn't top that list.

Also, I expect episodes from season 8 and 9 will completely replace that list.
any1else

Space Pope
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« Reply #221 on: 01-09-2016 12:31 »

she pointed out that it's no different to believing in flying saucers despite the fact that they both witnessed a flying saucer in close-range action at the end of the first movie

Actually, Scully had passed out, Mulder wanted her to see it but by the time she became fully conscious it was gone (gloviously) and then Mulder passed out, if I remember correctly, from the exhaustion of rushing to carry her out of the ship (she was too groggy to comprehend where she was) and then seeing it take off. I'm sure he also probably came in his pants a bit.

If you're sick of the "Scully's-a-sceptic" shtick, you're going to love season 8 and 9, when Doggett becomes the Scully, and Scully becomes the even more jump-to-conclusions-Muldery Mulder! And then Reyes becomes the hippy-trying-to-quit-smoking Mulder!

----

Small Potatoes and Post-Modern Prometheus have been on TV tonight, all bright and HD-like, after the recent release of the blurays. So purdy.

----

We just started season 9 in our re-watch. I think maybe I don't mind so much about Mulder being gone because I saw maybe one whole episode with Mulder (Je Souhaite, at the very least), and then I ended up watching all of season 8 the following year (my bedtime had been pushed back by then because I started high school, like a big girl). Around then my friend developed an obsession with the show when she caught the movie on TV, and with that I ended up seeing the whole show, got an account on the fox X Files forum (and Simpsons - Futurama was in a drop down menu but it seemed kind deserted at the time) and...so life began.

Anywhey.

Patience, Invocation, Redrum, Surekill, Salvage, Medusa, Vienen (Mulder and Doggett, together at last) and Alone all stuck in my head quite well as decent episodes in season 8. Even Badlaa, with the guy who crawls up people's butts, stayed in my head. I somehow didn't even comprehend that was what happened in that episode until I saw it again, but that just makes it better. Ahurr. That guy played the oompa loompas in the Charlie and the Chocolate factory remake, so that just makes everything better, doesn't it?

Season 9 has some memorable eps as well; 4-D, Lord of the Flies (the next episode we'll be watching), John Doe, Hellbound, Audrey Pauley, Improbable, Jump the Shark (the finale of The Long Gunmen series) and Sunshine Days (featuring Ben from Lawst).

As you can tell if you watch those, I tend to lean towards monster of the weeks. But I don't know if they're all necessarily good, I'm just saying I enjoyed them when I saw them on TV originally and I still like watching them now. But I'm not obsessed with picking apart every single flaw in media I consume and I know people would disagree with some of these, I'm just saying it's not all bad. Considering X-Files was always about nonsense crap happening...it's still X-Files, ya know?
AdrenalinDragon

Starship Captain
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« Reply #222 on: 01-25-2016 23:10 »

The first new episode of The X-Files was pretty weak. I hope things pick up, especially in the "Monster of the Week" episodes
cyber_turnip

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« Reply #223 on: 01-25-2016 23:42 »

Yeah. I wasn't expecting much from the first episode, to be honest. It's a lore episode and I've never enjoyed those as much as the monster of the week stuff - not to mention that Chris Carter and that lot couldn't even manage to produce lore episodes that pleased fans of those episodes in the last few seasons of the show.

Here's hoping that the new few are better. I have high hopes for "Mulder and Scully Meet the Were-Monster".
AdrenalinDragon

Starship Captain
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« Reply #224 on: 01-26-2016 22:38 »
« Last Edit on: 01-26-2016 22:39 »

Oh no! The second episode wasn't that good either. I'm really hoping the 3rd one can win me over. This is a bit disappointing, and I think there's something wrong with Scully's voice. She sounds a little raspy and quiet now. Come on Season 10, don't be as bad as Season 9! frown
JoshTheater

Space Pope
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« Reply #225 on: 02-02-2016 20:04 »

That was possibly Darin Morgan's best episode, and I don't say that lightly. I loved every second of it. Rhys Darby is fantastic.
cyber_turnip

Urban Legend
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« Reply #226 on: 02-02-2016 21:23 »

I've just started season 8 and so far, so good. That said, Mulder's still in these episodes so far, so maybe that's something to do with it.

Top 10 episodes of seasons 1-7:
10. Drive
9. Mind's Eye
8. X-Cops
7. How the Ghosts Stole Christmas
6. Our Town
5. Terms of Endearment
4. The Amazing Maleeni
3. Dreamland
2. Bad Blood
1. Paper Hearts

Top 10 episodes:
10. Mind's Eye
9. X-Cops
8. How the Ghosts Stole Christmas
7. Our Town
6. Terms of Endearment
5. The Amazing Maleeni
4. Mulder & Scully Meet the Were-Monster
3. Dreamland
2. Bad Blood
1. Paper Hearts
AdrenalinDragon

Starship Captain
****
« Reply #227 on: 02-18-2016 01:26 »

Babylon was utterly bizarre. It couldn't decide whether to be serious or comedic. In fact, it wasn't really X-Files-y at all. What was with the Mulder and Scully clones? Were they really needed at all? I did enjoy the drug trip sequence with Mulder, but it's a shame The Lone Gunman didn't get a line or two. Such a wasted opportunity there
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