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PEEL - The Futurama Message Board    Off Topic    It's got a TV!    Black, white, Klingon, or even female - Star Trek « previous next »
Author Topic: Black, white, Klingon, or even female - Star Trek  (Read 2585 times)
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PEE Poll: How many episodes of Star Trek have you seen?
0   -1 (14.3%)
1-100   -0 (0%)
101-200   -0 (0%)
201-300   -0 (0%)
301-400   -0 (0%)
401-500   -3 (42.9%)
501-600   -2 (28.6%)
601-700   -1 (14.3%)
700+   -0 (0%)
Total Members Voted: 7

hopie4ever

Bending Unit
***
« Reply #40 on: 10-20-2020 20:34 »

Babylon 5 is well worth a watch, a great story. Just make sure you find the guide that tells you when to watch the movies :)

The Expanse Season 1 was perfection, its been pretty great since then but Season 4 was just good, hoping the new season is another great one.

Having watched the season finale of Lower Decks, it got worse. New Star Trek is written to fill clickbait "what you missed" articles, not be entertaining for viewers.
Tachyon

DOOP Secretary
*
« Reply #41 on: 10-21-2020 00:29 »

Different strokes for different folks. If you find something entertaining, enjoy it.

Javier Lopez

Urban Legend
***
« Reply #42 on: 10-21-2020 08:15 »
« Last Edit on: 10-21-2020 08:21 »

I actually enjoyed Lowe Decks a lot..

Since its a heavy satire it has the leverage to do corny stuff without being "offensive" (like some characters on suposedly serious shows, ajem Discovery.. ajem Piccard) are ..

and they did too a LOT of puns and punches at Star Trek but while at the same time keeping the spirit close ...unlike Discovery or Piccard .. Also unlike both shows whoever wrote LD seem to at least have deep knowledge of star trek lore as it did threw a lot of quite obscure references.. i found myself reaching for memory alpha quite often to check references

As a note Expanse season 4 is markedly different pace and setting .. but its exactly what Book 4 is (wich is what the season 4 is based on after season 3 finally catched up with book 3 finale) .. since i read Cibola Burn (4th book) i knew there was going to be a lot of complains about pace change if they portrayed it accuratelly and they did wich i gotta give them kudos to sticking to the book material adapted for TV instead of "going away" .
the fact that the 2 book writers are also writers and producers on the show does help too .. tought recently Ty Frank said on twitter that they rarelly if ever had to "steer the show back to the books" or "ask" for a change in writing.. meaning they are so far quite in tune with the other writers and producers..

the final book "Leviathan falls" will be released next year and Ty has said several times there will be no spin offs or sequels. so the TV show if it gets lucky enought to keep going will have the patch fully writen.. and not have to steer away with dissastrous consencuences (ajem GoT)
newhook_1

Urban Legend
***
« Reply #43 on: 10-26-2020 13:54 »
« Last Edit on: 10-26-2020 14:07 »

I got around to finishing TOS and watched the first two movies. Season 3 was a real slog toward the end. I think it contains some of the only genuine bombs in the entire series. The Savage Curtain especially stands out. It's just The Arena with Abraham Lincoln for some reason.

The Motion Picture was OK. It felt more like good episode of Star Trek stretched out over two hours with an hour of filler. I looked it up on Wikipedia after I watched it and wasn't shocked to find out that that's exactly what it is. One thing that has aged well is the special effects. I thought the effects for going into warp speed  and the transporter were especially cool looking and I was kind of disappointed they didn't return in the second film. There wasn't a lot to the plot but even today this one was worth watching for the special effects alone. It's not that they're technically impressive today, but the artistic direction they take is quite cool. Really that's the story of the first movie, really cool artistic direction and aesthetics and special effects, but not much else of substance.

The Wrath of Khan is a masterpiece. I went in knowing vaguely that Spock dies somehow, because I'd absorbed it through years of pop culture references, and knowing Khan from a season one episode of TOS was the main villain. Spock, Bones and Kirk all seem like old friends in this one which was a welcome change from the first movie where they didn't even seem to like each other. Khan works really well as a villain whose tragic flaw is his obsession with getting revenge against Kirk. The story and dialogue were engaging and Kirk using his experience to outsmart Khan played well into the theme of getting old. I liked that they gave Kirk a son. Great movie. I'd put it up there with The Empire Strikes Back.

Is The Motion Picture even considered canon anymore? It ends with Kirk at the helm of the Enterprise and in The Wrath of Khan, he hasn't commanded the Enterprise in what seems like a long time. It also seems like they just discarded a bunch of stuff like the new uniforms. It comes off as though they just hit the reset button.
Tachyon

DOOP Secretary
*
« Reply #44 on: 10-26-2020 15:31 »

The Motion Picture was never finished, actually. It was rushed beyond salvation to meet a holiday release date.

That's from a movie geek, former projectionist, sorta-trekkie friend.

newhook_1

Urban Legend
***
« Reply #45 on: 10-26-2020 16:15 »
« Last Edit on: 10-26-2020 16:16 »

The Motion Picture was never finished, actually. It was rushed beyond salvation to meet a holiday release date.

That's from a movie geek, former projectionist, sorta-trekkie friend.



I could see that. It comes off almost as a proof of concept to show what a big budget Star Trek movie could potentially look like. Almost like a tech demo for a new game console.
newhook_1

Urban Legend
***
« Reply #46 on: 10-29-2020 14:49 »
« Last Edit on: 10-29-2020 14:53 »

More thoughts:

The Search for Spock - I really enjoyed this one too. I thought Christopher Lloyd was great as Kruge. I enjoyed the Enterprise crew turning their back on the Federation for the first time in the history of the series, and the Enterprise getting blown up. I really don't understand why so many people dislike this one.

The Voyage Home- This one is well loved. I enjoyed it, but I kind of liked Search For Spock better and none of the movies I've watched up to this point have come close to the high water mark of the Wrath of Khan imho. I am going into all these pretty well blind and I had no idea they went back in time, so it was all a surprise to me. This was a nice change of pace and injected some much needed humor into the film series.

The Final Frontier- This was weird. It was bad, but it wasn't boring like The Motion Picture. It was more a movie that has no three act structure or significant conflict. I read some of the background and I am absolutely fascinated by this movie.  It's like it was envisioned as a series of sketches and set pieces as opposed to a complete three act movie script. The scene where they climb the elevator shaft is a perfect example. So they end up in the elevator shaft because it's the only way to get to the room to send a message to Starfleet. They are climbing a ladder, but Spock leaves, gets rocket boots from somewhere, then comes in from above. Where did he go? They're trying to get up. He came from above. He clearly didn't take the rocket boots up there. Why couldn't they have just taken whatever route Spock took? So realistically the only reason they're in the elevator shaft is to get Spock back in the rocket boots, because whoever was writing it had the rocket boot scene pictured in their head, and was trying to come up with a way to get to that. So this whole section of the movie only exists for the sake of the little rocket boot sketch. It has nothing to do with the overall plot, it doesn't drive anything forward, it's like its own little vignette and they came up with just enough connective tissue to try and link it to the rest of the movie. They could have simply went from the brig to the lounge where they try to conflict Star Fleet and it would have made no difference to the overall plot. It's fascinating. It's almost written like Monty Python's Meaning of Life.

David A

Space Pope
****
« Reply #47 on: 10-30-2020 00:50 »

The Search for Spock - I really enjoyed this one too. I thought Christopher Lloyd was great as Kruge. I enjoyed the Enterprise crew turning their back on the Federation for the first time in the history of the series, and the Enterprise getting blown up. I really don't understand why so many people dislike this one.

My only real complaint is that they recast Lieutenant Saavik.  Other than that, I think it's a great film.

I like how the second, third, and fourth films are part of one continuous storyline, but each can still be watched on its own without the other two.
newhook_1

Urban Legend
***
« Reply #48 on: 10-30-2020 13:35 »
« Last Edit on: 10-30-2020 13:42 »

The Search for Spock - I really enjoyed this one too. I thought Christopher Lloyd was great as Kruge. I enjoyed the Enterprise crew turning their back on the Federation for the first time in the history of the series, and the Enterprise getting blown up. I really don't understand why so many people dislike this one.

My only real complaint is that they recast Lieutenant Saavik.  Other than that, I think it's a great film.

I like how the second, third, and fourth films are part of one continuous storyline, but each can still be watched on its own without the other two.

Agreed.

I watched the Undiscovered country last night. I enjoyed it, but other than being a good sendoff to the TOS crew and a good allegory for the end of the Cold War, I don't have many thoughts on it. When I think of the Star Trek movies in the future I'm going to think of II, III & IV. Those are the three where is seems like they were really firing on all cylinders.
Tachyon

DOOP Secretary
*
« Reply #49 on: 10-30-2020 18:47 »

Undiscovered Country took a long time to grow on me, but I'm at the point where I can enjoy nearly all of the ST movies.

Regarding the various series...it disappoints me to say that I'm honestly shocked by the awful writing in season 2 of Discovery, especially as I'd often heard that the S2 writing was considered substantially better than S1.

Belatedly I realized that some of the change was due to the deliberate effort to bring the episodes closer to classic Trek, but my impression is that the scripts have been oversimplified (from a science/technical point of view) and now have ELI5-style exposition wedged into the dialog in an effort to appeal to non-sci-fi audiences, as well as completely throwing off the balance of the Michael Burnham character by making her ridiculously uber-competent—till now, her mental and physical skills and talents have been countered by the overarching tragedy of her character, in that everything she touches turns to profound disaster in the most delicious star-crossed, monkey-paw tradition.

Which floats a thought to the surface of my mind: I don't understand the context of the continual references to her being responsible for starting the war: of course the tragic unintended consequences resulting in the martyr and unifying the Klingon houses is straightforward, but my parsing of all the "you started the war" comments seem to imply that the war was caused by her defiant actions on the bridge before the battle of the binary stars began. Is everyone criticizing her for NOT being successful in her defiance/mutiny? Or am I missing something really obvious?

One awesome "aspect" of S2 is the fact that it's shot with very wide-angle, cinematic lenses, which makes for a richer and more immersive visual experience. Can't wait until I can watch it upscaled to 1440p to fill my monitor completely from top to bottom. The sound work is also fantastic, and slips in some cool subsonics from time to time without getting all over-the-top with them.

So my short hiatus from Discovery is over, and I'm watching it with an altered attitude. I enjoy the characters a lot, and, like much of Trek, the actors really seem to be developing a family-like rapport among the whole crew. Re-watching the first S2 eps with commentary from Alex Kurtzman, Sonequa Martin-Green, and Jonathan Frakes shows how much excitement and enjoyment the cast was having, and definitely took a lot of the edge off my initial disappointment.

newhook_1

Urban Legend
***
« Reply #50 on: 12-18-2020 13:49 »

I ended up tapping out for The Next Generation, it was too much of a slog. It wasn't poorly written or acted or anything like that, just a bit too dry for me. I ended up using a guide and watching these episodes. Right around the episodes in season four or five it started to grow on me, but it's still a bit serious for my taste. Favourite episode I watched was probably a tossup between Reunion, The Inner Light and Chain of Command. Basically anytime Stewart really got to show his acting chops. I might go back and watch some of the later seasons in full later. I will be frank though, life is too short to watch season one and two of The Next Generation. They are brutally dry and procedural.
David A

Space Pope
****
« Reply #51 on: 12-18-2020 15:25 »

The Inner Light

That one's my favorite.

I will be frank though, life is too short to watch season one and two of The Next Generation. They are brutally dry and procedural.

Like I said before, it took the show a couple of seasons to find its footing.  I still think that there are a few gems scattered among the early season episodes that are worth watching though.
newhook_1

Urban Legend
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« Reply #52 on: 12-18-2020 15:44 »

I did like Conspiracy quite a bit.
David A

Space Pope
****
« Reply #53 on: 12-18-2020 16:22 »

I liked that one, but it seemed like it was a set up for a later storyline that never got picked up, which is kind of a shame, really.
Tachyon

DOOP Secretary
*
« Reply #54 on: 12-19-2020 01:47 »

"I would also recommend watching episodes of The Next Generation in remastered form on Blu-ray"

Wait...what? When the heck did this happen?

* * Tachy checks his ST collection * *

Ah, I was mixing up TNG and DS9—the latter is the series that was only available on DVD when I ordered.

Also, the other day I realized that I haven't watched Star Trek: Beyond since I saw in in the theatre with my brother the month after release. Perhaps I'll correct that oversight tonight or tomorrow :)

newhook_1

Urban Legend
***
« Reply #55 on: 12-31-2020 12:59 »

I watched the last four movies. First Contact was far and away the best and I really enjoyed it. I'd put Generations next even though I think it would have been better without the original crew. The other two were pretty meh. I was very dissapointed in the TNG movies overall, though I would put First Contact right below II-IV. Here's how I'd rank the movies:

II
III
IV
VIII
VI
I
VII
IX
X
V

The first one is weird. It's by far the most boring movie in terms of action, but I also like its production design and costuming and effects the best.
David A

Space Pope
****
« Reply #56 on: 12-31-2020 14:41 »

I'm pretty sure that Generations and First Contact are the only TNG movies that I bothered to watch.  At least, they're the only ones that I remember having seen.

Generations isn't a bad film, if, for some reason, you didn't get enough closure from watching The Undiscovered Country and really need to know the final fate of Captain Kirk.

I didn't like First Contact, for a number of reasons.  The movie plays fast and loose with the established lore regarding Zefram Cochrane,  although I suppose that's not really a big deal.

The bigger problem is the Borg.  I preferred how the Borg were dealt with in the series (and as far as I'm concerned, they were dealt with conclusively).  Bringing them back in a movie (and also in Voyager) just seems like lazy writing that disrespects what came before.

The introduction of a Borg queen completely contradicts everything about what the Borg are.  I'm guessing that someone must have used the word "hivemind" to describe the Borg, and someone else must have decided that if they're like a beehive, then there must be a queen.  Well, no; that's not what a hivemind is, not at all.

Also, if I want to see Patrick Stewart as Captain Ahab, they have a version of Moby Dick for that.
newhook_1

Urban Legend
***
« Reply #57 on: 12-31-2020 17:30 »

They 100% dumbed down TNG for a mass audience in First Contact. I can see finding it distasteful if you were really into the show. I just enjoyed it for what is was, a solid, dumb sci-fi action movie.
David A

Space Pope
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« Reply #58 on: 01-01-2021 03:53 »

As a dumb sci-fi action movie it works, but as a Star Trek movie it was just disappointing, especially when compared to the first six.
Tweek

UberMod
DOOP Secretary
*
« Reply #59 on: 01-29-2021 15:14 »

I actually enjoyed Lower Decks a lot...


Me too; watched it recently and found every episode to be amusing. I often chuckled and occasionally burst out into proper laughter :laff:
captjim

Bending Unit
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« Reply #60 on: 01-31-2021 06:20 »

when i think about first contact, the first thing that comes to mind is its revelation of the borg's biggest weakness: tricking them into going to the holodeck two at a time.

incidentally, i think this is my first time posting here in like a decade. man, i got old.
newhook_1

Urban Legend
***
« Reply #61 on: 03-19-2021 12:38 »
« Last Edit on: 03-19-2021 12:41 »

I ended up watching Piccard. After watching TOS, and a big chunk of TNG and the ten original movies and then Piccard all for the first time within the span of a year, man Piccard was just a complete flaming pile of shit. It made me think the TNG movies maybe weren't so bad.

"Here, take this magic rock that can do anything."

It kind of flies in the face of the the hundred odd episodes and ten movies I watched over the last year, but cool, I guess.
Tachyon

DOOP Secretary
*
« Reply #62 on: 03-20-2021 00:43 »

I watched S1 of Picard over the course of a few weeks, shortly after binging Discovery S1 and S2. I liked them both, a lot, despite some elements I had to take simply because it's space opera. Different storytelling can appeal to different people.

e.g., Star Trek: The Motion Picture (which was never technically finished for release) blows chunks of dolphin vomit as far as I'm concerned. Some people liked it. Other than Undiscovered Country and Nemesis I've enjoyed the rest of the movies a lot, and I don't even dislike those two. The Dominion War arc in DS9 mostly bores me and I still enjoy a lot of episodes. Luckily there's plenty of Trek material for most everyone :)

newhook_1

Urban Legend
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« Reply #63 on: 03-20-2021 01:54 »

Oh yeah, it's totally subjective. One man's flaming pile of shit is another man's treasure.

It doesn't help that I strongly dislike heavily serialized television, which was one of the appeals of Star Trek when I started watching last year in the first place.
David A

Space Pope
****
« Reply #64 on: 03-20-2021 02:07 »

Unfortunately, I think that you've probably already seen all the Trek that's worth watching at this point, unless you want to track down the animated series.
hopie4ever

Bending Unit
***
« Reply #65 on: 03-20-2021 04:36 »

Memory Alpha (which includes the movies in their count) now counts over 800 star trek "episodes", for me its diminishing returns at the moment, but I will always hope for former glories to be found.
newhook_1

Urban Legend
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« Reply #66 on: 03-20-2021 13:48 »

Unfortunately, I think that you've probably already seen all the Trek that's worth watching at this point, unless you want to track down the animated series.

Well, it was fun while it lasted. I have thrown on a couple of episodes of the animated series. I've been enjoying those.

I watched the Orville recently as well. That was good shit. Hopefully that gets a couple more seasons.
David A

Space Pope
****
« Reply #67 on: 03-20-2021 19:41 »

Have you seen the movie Galaxy Quest?  If not, you might want to give that a watch.  Even if you have seen it before, watching it again with your newfound knowledge of Star Trek might give you more appreciation for some of the humor.
Tachyon

DOOP Secretary
*
« Reply #68 on: 03-21-2021 00:58 »
« Last Edit on: 03-21-2021 01:02 »

Galaxy Quest is one of my favorite movies, and the cast plays it just straight enough to draw you in. And of course I have no idea whether they enjoyed making the film or were exasperated out of their minds, but they looked like they were having fun and it really is a great film, with a lot of heart.

RIP Alan Rickman :( I've seen less than 15 minutes in total watching the Harry Potter movies, and have zero desire to watch any of them in their entirety. But I suspect I might enjoy Alan Rickman's character. Maybe someday...

* edit  *

And I unashamedly admit that I loved the fun fanservice with Sigourney Weaver's character, along with her brilliantly sardonic running commentary concerning the sets / plot :)

newhook_1

Urban Legend
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« Reply #69 on: 03-21-2021 01:54 »

Oh don't you worry. Galaxy Quest has been in my regular rotation for years. I did watch it again about a month ago with a new appreciation for it.
Javier Lopez

Urban Legend
***
« Reply #70 on: 03-22-2021 17:43 »

Galaxy Quest should be mandatory view for any sci-fi/space opera fan.. specially Star Trek but even those not fond with ST (ie me) will get and love GQ
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