Game of Thrones

[Reply #80 on:]

I did last night. :3

[Reply #81 on:]

Bow wow chicka chicka...

What did you think of the giant, winna? Wasn't he big?
I want to see him fight some white walkers.

[Reply #82 on:]

There's just enough supernatural elements in the show to make them compelling.  He was rather large, and they do a fine job of interlacing the real with the effects magic.

Also, I started reading the books, and unfortunately it feels like I'm just going back over something I already know... the show basically parallels the books pretty awesomely (far as I can tell from the first book and what I remember of the first season).  Short of a few details that is..... >_>

[Reply #83 on:]

I'm sad we didn't get to see Aria in the first episode.

[Reply #84 on:]

I've just been talking about a GoT/HP crossover elsewhere. I now really want to see Joffrey Baratheon being given a dressing-down by Severus Snape. The rest of it would be shit, but that one scene could make it worth watching.

[Reply #85 on:]

Aria

...

[Reply #86 on:]

I'm avoiding reading this thread for fear of spoilers but I'd like to know from anyone who has read the books whether it is worth reading them or enjoying the TV show first. I've literally only just started (episode 4 series 1 is next on my viewing list).

[Reply #87 on:]

I started reading the books recently.  I've watched the series as it airs.  After having just finished the first book, I can say with certainty that the show follows closely with the source material.  Some small details are changed, and of course the books contain ever more details... and there are ever so many details.  Some small details in the show that you might never notice are further expounded upon by reading the material and watching it.

That said... which should you enjoy first?  I planned on just watching the series and then reading the books... but somebody had to ruin that by giving me the books for christmas.  Whichever you choose to go with, be prepared that you're likely to want more material produced because you've finished with all the material thus far.... Five books printed at ~800 pages a piece, and the full story has yet to be fully told...  the show is in its 3rd season, so even longer to get to... furthermore, it is my understanding that the show will diverge from how the story is presented in the books.  Books III and IV or IV and V, I forget which (possibly all three), take place concurrently but are told from different viewpoints.  I believe I've heard that the show aims to tell the story linearly, which makes sense given that it's a show.

If you decide to watch the show first, be prepared for most every episode to end on an exciting point; usually a cliffhanger.  That's an enjoyable aspect, gets a lot of emphasis out of it.  If you decide to read the books first, you might get the opportunity to paint the world with your imaginations without fear of the show's imagery creeping in to place it all for you.

As for me, had I known about the books before I started watching... I'd have probably preferred to read the whole story before watching the series at all.  This would mean putting off watching the show which is currently airing until the last book(s) are published... which very well may never happen; if the author dies.  As it is now, I'm reading the books quickly in order to get to parts of the story I don't know about yet... I pretty much remembered most of the large details through out the first book from the show, so it was following old ground.  You may get a different appreciation for various characters in different ways depending upon which way you choose to consume the media first.

Hopefully this may help you in your decision.  It's a difficult consideration to make with this one because both representations are excellent.  Personally, I have no regrets watching through the first two seasons before reading the books.

[Reply #88 on:]

Read the books as soon as you have time. They're worth it.

[Reply #89 on:]

I noticed that a dialogue from Catelyn, and the character with which she was speaking in the newest episode seemed to come directly from the first book, despite the fact that the event surrounding their communication must occur much later.  I'm guessing the third book, though I'm currently pushing through the first.

The dialogue seemed virtually the same, and it's nice to see the show adapting these details from the source work.  However, it's one of a few subtle indications that events in the show do not happen necessarily in the same order, or even in some instances in the same way, as their counterparts in the book.  This isn't a particular hindrance to either, but something that I've noticed once I started reading.

I'm sad we didn't get to see Aria in the first episode.

Her name is pronounced Arr-yuh and is spelled Arya. She is a Stark from Winterfell. :scowl:

[Reply #90 on:]

You already pointed out my mistake, dickweed.

Excuse me for being a musician and assuming it was spelled like the musical term.

[Reply #91 on:]

Thank you.

[Reply #92 on:]

You already pointed out my mistake, dickweed.

Excuse me for being a musician and assuming it was spelled like the musical term.

You'll be excused when you learn how to play the theme tune on a kazoo and put it on youtube.

[Reply #93 on:]

Would that be a G kazoo or a B♭ kazoo?

[Reply #94 on:]

I'll need plenty of both for the kazoo orchestra (Kazorchestra) I have planned.

[Reply #95 on:]

Fuck yeah, Team Targaryen!

[Reply #96 on:]

Oh, so you speak Valyrian? Hrmm...

[Reply #97 on:]

Holy motherloving shit, that was epic.

[Reply #98 on:]

Holy motherloving shit, that was epic.

I think you mean "holy daughterfucking bastard, that was good".

Dracarys.

[Reply #99 on:]

Josh got it right.  Dany is the mother of dragons.

[Reply #100 on:]

You might want to go pick that up, I think it flew over your head.

[Reply #101 on:]

I don't know, I am beginning to get a sense of Mary Sue about her.  Not entirely, of course, because it is still fun to watch a teenager wanting her throne back.  But it also seems a bit over the top that she is constantly able to win her way through.  She points at what she wants and she gets what she wants.  And moreover, she plans these things herself.

This makes me feel somewhat suspect.  And while it haven't reached that point yet, it does give me a worry of my belief in the character.  All the other characters have their ups and downs (although, mostly downs), while she doesn't really.

Now I get that having her fail and being killed off would be stupid, because then the threat of her returning to Westeros would be for nothing.  Anyway, I just find it a whole bit ridiculous.

I also plan on reading the books, but unfortunately I still have to get through The Guns of August and The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire, and I still have trouble finding time for those to begin with!  By which I mean to say; I wonder how these situations are portrayed in the books.

[Reply #102 on:]

Well she certainly had her ups and downs in the first two seasons, it's only recently that she's pretty much straight badass. It seems like once she proved herself the mother of dragons by going through those trials and rescuing them from the warlock, she's inherited some kind of magical power through her relationship with the dragons that just makes her all kinds of awesome. My assumption has been that her badassery is the result of some prophecy being fulfilled, or something like that. She's clearly special, since she's the only one the dragons obey and her whole immunity to fire thing. She's just now starting to realize it and really take control of her power.

[Reply #103 on:]

Her being immune to fire doesn't bother me.  But her trials was sort of ... easy.  The only real hindrance to them so far has been her own naïveté.  Her belief in justice and how she insists that the slaves are freed and whatnot.  That's admirable and exactly how her character is.  She wishes to right the wrongs in the world.  She also emphasises that she intends to kill the people who possesses her throne, but not all the people of Westeros.

What bothers me, is that her own naïveté is no longer a problem.  Perhaps she realises that no one can be trusted.  But that should have made her more cynical, it has instead just her more cunning.  I am certain she did not share her plans because she wanted Jorah and Barristan to question her publicly, so Kraznys would think she was stupid.

It's a clever plan and not one that necessary relies on luck (which is why I like it), but it certainly feels like one that required her to be familiar with Slaver's Bay in a way that she doesn't seem to be before they arrive.  Of course, I could be wrong.

It's not that it feels out of place just yet, but if her success trip continues, I'll begin to wonder and worry.

[Reply #104 on:]

Well... her husband and child kind of died... and they were both pretty awesome... well the boy would have been awesome and mounted the world anyways.

Instead she got dragons... and she's been wandering around and was basically looking to ask for help in Quarth.  I think the turning point now is that she realizes she has to take things, and the show runners have stated as much as well.

I don't think she's quite a Mary Sue, but yes her tribulations should in some resounding way be triumphant for the reason you stated svip.  I don't think this inherently needs to fulfill a prophecy either, although if it did it wouldn't be ludicrous; ultimately she's going to have to take what she wants, and she's come to terms with that.  She can't rely on others wholly... and I don't think she needed foreknowledge of Slaver's Bay to do what she did.  She knew she needed an army, so she went somewhere to obtain that... then she made a trade, and after the demonstrations, she must have been fairly sure she could do what she did.  She rolled the dice, but I think she was willing to accept that it might not have played out as it did, and would have had other plans in her head for how to deal with the situation if it didn't favor that one.  Luckily (which is why you're questioning) it panned out for the badass option, which isn't wholly unbelievable to me.  It's not Star Wars Episode One Phantom Menace luck that's propelling her forward, and her misfortunes are far more believable in my opinion than Anakin being a slave super great pod racer midichlorian wonder.

In Quarth, her biggest challenge was letting go of her deceased husband and child.... this has been portrayed in other series before; one of the simplest and most poignant in recent mind being Red Dwarf season 10 when Lister was offered a virtual Kochanski to "live" happily ever after.  Granted that was more of a cop out and cock tease at the fans, but the idea itself is philosophically sound in my opinion.



I watched the Inside the Episode things after the episodes recently, and the show runners go in depth in explaining the development of the characters and their perspectives.  I've also started reading the series (halfway through book 2) and I think a lot of these things go into greater detail and more sensibility than the tv show.  Of course it's hard to pack all the subtle things into 10 episodes, but I think the show does a decent job of it given the monumental task set before it of replicating the sense of the books; some things it might be doing even better than its source (foreign languages being the most prominent in my mind).

[Reply #105 on:]

Good episode, Tywin is so boss.

[Reply #106 on:]

The best line was when Arya told Gendry that he could be her family.

[Reply #107 on:]

Awesome picture.  Now all we have to do is make a SMW mod where you play as Eddard Stark traveling along Westeros..... oh... maybe that's not the best idea.

[Reply #108 on:]

There's already a video game that came out recently that ends with your character being killed.

[Reply #109 on:]

2010 is recent?

[Reply #110 on:]

So, Emilia Daenerys Stormborn Targaryan of the Blood of Old Valyria Khaleesi Mother of Dragons etc. etc. etc. Clarke is going to be on Futurama?

Awesome!

[Reply #111 on:]

NOOOOO  Joffery killed Ros.

[Reply #112 on:]

Spoilers much?  Although I don't think Ros necessarily has an equivalent in the books... not one named Ros anyways.

Also, I'm not sure why that happened.  Just reinforcing that he's a sick puppy?

[Reply #113 on:]

[Reply #114 on:]

Also, I'm not sure why that happened.  Just reinforcing that he's a sick puppy?

Basically, I suppose.  Ros' death was already explained fine, but we had to see it.  To reinforce what we already knew.  I admit, I sort of preferred the uncertainty about it so far, because we all suspected it, but we did not have concrete prove.

[Reply #115 on:]

I didn't know she was dead.  I don't remember that ever being hinted at.  That's why I was so confused by it.  it was just random I'm Joffrey and I like crossbows!  Also look at this naked chick I have sprung up across my bed! Cheerio!

[Reply #116 on:]

What do you mean it wasn't hinted at? I thought it was pretty straightforward and in context...Baelish implied pretty heavily that he'd had Ros killed in his conversation with Varys practically seconds before they showed her body. He found out that her and Varys were conspiring against him (Ros told Varys about him planning to leave with Sansa, which Varys stopped) so he gave her to Joffrey and probably said something like "Do whatever you want with her because nobody will care if she's missing." As we've seen last season, we already know Joffrey enjoys torturing prostitutes, so the chance to use one as target practice was probably too much for him to pass up.

[Reply #117 on:]

What's more troubling, is that if winna did not know she was dead, then why did ask why the scene was there?  Ros' death is interesting because it reveals that Baelish had found out about Ros and Varys, and particularly Varys conspiring against Baelish.

Ros' death was perhaps not necessary, only to underline Joffrey's sadistic nature, but I don't feel we needed more emphasis on that.  But interesting, while that scene is more less optional, the scene that went before is not optional.  Imagine merely the death scene of Ros, would leave you asking; 'why is she with Joffrey?  What happened?'

Regardless, I think - in additional to underline Joffrey's nature - I also think the scene was part of a montage over Baelish's speech, and a nice note to end the scene in the throne room, and transition into the climb on the wall.

[Reply #118 on:]

Oh okay that makes sense then.  The conversation between Baelish and Varys was going over my head a bit... it also should've been something I pieced together with that first episode when Ros tells Shae not to trust him with her....

The show clearly put it together in a reasonable way and then let the audience put the pieces together, but somehow I missed it and am now a dumb.

[Reply #119 on:]

There had actually been a few other scenes than just the one with Ros warning Shae about Baelish taking Sansa with her that led up to the scene in the last episode. After that first scene, there was a scene where Ros talks to Varys about Baelish's plan since she knows Varys would love a chance to mess with Baelish, and then after that another scene where Varys spoke with Lady Tyrell about preventing Baelish from leaving with Sansa (to prevent him from having control of the heir to the North), which led to the Tyrells suggesting that Sansa should marry Ser Loras in order to keep her in King's Landing.

Not sure how you managed to miss all of that, but I guess it happens.