Simpsons has gone on long enough

[Reply #120 on:]

 

Originally posted by Kryten:
Teesside, usually, there's a warning first, but you've HAD those. I'm skipping straight ahead to Dodecuple Secret Probation.

How is it a secret if you announce it?   

[Reply #121 on:]

they are kinda dull fight now but matt wont forget the famous family

[Reply #122 on:]

Irrespective of how much you think the Simpsons have faltered, the fact remains that the series is still very popular...ergo it will remain on the air. So who's looking forward to Season 16?

BTW, vote for your fave cast member at http://www.peelified.com/cgi-bin/Futurama/14-001359-1/

[Reply #123 on:]

 

Originally posted by darthmonkey32:
they are kinda dull fight now but matt wont forget the famous family

You made a bump of four months for this? 

Well, The Simpsons isn't quite as good as it was in seasons 2-8, but it's a hell of a lot better than it was in seasons 10-12. It's still a great show, especially when compared to the rest of the crap on TV these days...

[Reply #124 on:]

 

Originally posted by leelaholic:
 It's still a great show, especially when compared to the rest of the crap on TV these days...

 You do realise how little that's saying though, right?
 

[Reply #125 on:]

I've seen a few older episodes and some newer ones and I couldn't tell the difference. I don't see what the big deal is.

[Reply #126 on:]

   

Originally posted by Mouse On Venus:
  You do realise how little that's saying though, right?

Well, since I used the word "crap", I obviously do. Besides, I didn't say that it was only good compared to the other shows, I said that it was good on its own, but even more so compared to other shows. That's why I used the word "especially".

[Reply #127 on:]

Even though I hate most modern Simpsons, I'd still take them over practically anything else on TV at the moment...

[Reply #128 on:]

 

Originally posted by darthmonkey32:
they are kinda dull fight now but matt wont forget the famous family

Wow, what tremendous insight!  And only four months after the previous post!  I salute you, oh super-genius of the future!

[Reply #129 on:]

I think The Simpsons has reached the point now where it's like Friends or Frasier - no longer part of the classic comedy canon but a nice piece of filler that your average Joe doesn't have to think too much about. It's a comedy distraction, which, with the demise of the aforementioned other shows, is now one of the only half reliable ones still going.

 I think those who harken back to the old days when every episode fell between "great" and "certified classic" are the people who want the show to be pulled immediately, whilst those who can accept it as a regular TV liason, a la reality shows or soap operas, are the side who believe the show still has relevance. And at this point, I couldn't care less what the show does now.

[Reply #130 on:]

 

Originally posted by Otis P Jivefunk:
Even though I hate most modern Simpsons, I'd still take them over practically anything else on TV at the moment...

second, the new simpsons episodes are bad but stil a lot better than most other shows   

[Reply #131 on:]

 

Originally posted by Mouse On Venus:

 I think those who harken back to the old days when every episode fell between "great" and "certified classic" are the people who want the show to be pulled immediately, whilst those who can accept it as a regular TV liason, a la reality shows or soap operas, are the side who believe the show still has relevance.

I don't think that's necasarily fair.  For me personally, I do in fact harken back to the "good old days" (season 1-8 IMO) and lament that the show will likely never quite reach those standards again.  But at the same time, I still consider the current show to be excellent, and I think of it as more then just mindless filler.  I think it still has some great emotional elements, great satiric elements, and generally great humor as well. And I'm far from alone in having those sentiments. I think most of the people who consider the show now to be "mindless filler" in fact probably thought of the show in that way to begin with (the types who would watch "Lisa's Substitute" and be completely unmoved, or watch "Homer: Badman" and not even have it occur to them that the episode was satiric).

[Reply #132 on:]

 

Originally posted by iliketowankalot:
I think they should start killing off characters, when a character dies it usually generates some interest, they got hundreds of characters so they got plots for a few more hundred episodes

I love this idea but if it dosnt work i have a beter plan to spice up the show

either they start making better episodes now or when it dies, which i think will be about... Season 20, we should re-arange the episode so they start at there worst and end at the best, so there slowly getting better and better. The old Simpsons seems better than the new ones but the new ones are not bad just not as good as the first. New genration that comes along after simpsons is axed will see it from its pitfall to its peak... and every body whos not happy, well they'll be old and will hopefully die.

[Reply #133 on:]

If the new generations started at it's "pitfall", then they probabaly wouldn't care about the characters enough to get to it's "peak"...

[Reply #134 on:]

The Simpsons has been abysmal these past few seasons. I don't mean "worse than it used to be, but better than most of what you see on TV nowadays", which I haven't thought since season 8 or 9. I mean most of the episodes have been absolute crap. The Simpsons hit rock bottom with episodes like Take the Alligator and Run. However, I think there's been some improvement this past season. There were some clunkers like The President Wore Pearls, but there were also several decent episodes that made me laugh. I started watching The Simpsons on Sunday nights again, instead of just downloading episodes when I got bored. So I think there's some hope for the show and I'll be tuning in when season 16 starts.

[Reply #135 on:]

I've said many times before I still enjoy the current, and if it keeps it's current quality I'll still watch it, but because these episodes can't touch the older episodes, I think it may be doing harm to the series as a whole. Just my opinion, I don't want this to become another No Homers club like debate. Suffice to say, I'd like to see the Simpsons phased out over the next year or two and Fox's marketing muscle put behind a new cartoon(Let's face it Futurama isn't coming back to FOX ), or maybe even Family Guy which has tons of potintial and IMO is one of the  funniest cartoon ever made(remember there is a difference between funniest and best).

*Edit* Actually, Otis puts the point I was trying to make quite nicely:
 

Originally posted by Otis P Jivefunk:
If the new generations started at it's "pitfall", then they probabaly wouldn't care about the characters enough to get to it's "peak"...

[Reply #136 on:]

I agree that the Simpsons should end. Some of the new eps., but most are mediocure and sometimes offensive (ex.: the anti-kid ep.).

[Reply #137 on:]

If we're thinking of the same one,that's not all that new, John. Compared to 14th and 15th season fodder, that one's pretty good (I rather like it)

I just think that the writer aren't given enough time, in several senses. They tack them together too quickly, and are only allowed about 16 minutes of show. Used to be...what, 23? It's all just commercials. I'd say that one of the worst examples of this season's writing would be the one where Milhouse moves to Capital City (can't think of title, someone'll correct me). There is never a straight plot, and muddy A&B storylines. Right pissed me off.

[Reply #138 on:]

Shauker, don't encourage him by pretending his posts make sense. 

[Reply #139 on:]

 

Originally posted by newhook_1:
I've said many times before I still enjoy the current, and if it keeps it's current quality I'll still watch it, but because these episodes can't touch the older episodes, I think it may be doing harm to the series as a whole.

[/QUOTE]

I used to feel about the same way, but I actually think the show may just be past that kind of reasoning now.  Let's face it, the show has been on for a long time past its prime.  Using the usual theory that 1-8 was the prime, the last "classic era" season ended in 1997.  That's a long time ago at this point.  So its gone on long enough that continuing isn't going to effect its reputation much, and it can't hurt its reputation beyond what 10-12 already did.  Plus, working on the assumption that the show is still very good (and I feel it is), I figure the more good Simpsons the better, and it might as well continue as long as it remains entertaining.  I can emphasize with the feeling that it should end before it goes too far past its prime so it can save some face, but I think at this point its been on so long past its prime anyway that it doesn't much matter anymore.  Might as well just restore the show as closely as possible to its former glory, which is what they seem to be trying to do.

[Reply #140 on:]

leelaholic, shut the fuck up.

I'm more curious what this 'movie' will be.

[Reply #141 on:]

   

Originally posted by Shaucker:
If we're thinking of the same one,that's not all that new, John. Compared to 14th and 15th season fodder, that one's pretty good (I rather like it)

I thinking of "Marge vs. Singles, Seniors, Childless Couples and Teens, and Gays", the first first-run Simpsons I've seen since "Behind the laughter" (man, I've been gone a long time).

 

Originally posted by Nurdbot:
leelaholic, shut the fuck up.

I'm more curious what this 'movie' will be.

Nurdbot, you're right, but watch your language.

[Reply #142 on:]

John Pannozzi, it's not in your authority to tell Nurdbot not to swear, this is an open message board.

[Reply #143 on:]

 

Originally posted by DotheBartman:
 
I don't think that's necasarily fair.  For me personally, I do in fact harken back to the "good old days" (season 1-8 IMO) and lament that the show will likely never quite reach those standards again.  But at the same time, I still consider the current show to be excellent, and I think of it as more then just mindless filler.

 I've seen two Season 15 episodes: "I D'ohbot" and "Diatribe...". The first thing that comes to mind when I think of these two episodes is how both the plots could've been done several years ago. Battlebots is a fairly dated concept now and the Marge "bored, neglected housewife" idea is nothing new. The show's relevance to cultural satire and parody isn't represented particularly well in these examples.
 That said, I quite enjoyed "I, D'ohbot" though I certainly wouldn't hail it as a classic, and as for "Diatribe..." I think I must've been missing something as it came across as quite Scully-esque for me, even if there was some 'emotion' involved.

   

I think most of the people who consider the show now to be "mindless filler" in fact probably thought of the show in that way to begin with (the types who would watch "Lisa's Substitute" and be completely unmoved, or watch "Homer: Badman" and not even have it occur to them that the episode was satiric).

 Emphasis on the word "most".

[Reply #144 on:]

 

I've seen two Season 15 episodes: "I D'ohbot" and "Diatribe...". The first thing that comes to mind when I think of these two episodes is how both the plots could've been done several years ago. Battlebots is a fairly dated concept now and the Marge "bored, neglected housewife" idea is nothing new. The show's relevance to cultural satire and parody isn't represented particularly well in these examples.
That said, I quite enjoyed "I, D'ohbot" though I certainly wouldn't hail it as a classic, and as for "Diatribe..." I think I must've been missing something as it came across as quite Scully-esque for me, even if there was some 'emotion' involved.

For the record "Diatribe" wasn't one of the better episodes emotion wise in this last sesaon.  I enjoyed it for the humor, but I'd definitely suggest something like "The Way We Weren't" or the excellent "My Mother the Carjacker" over it.  As for "I-D'oh-Bot" I don't think that episode was trying to be particularly satirical, so much as it was just putting a new spin on the Homer/Bart dynamic.  And I think robot competitions and so forth do still exist (including shows dedicated to them) even if "Battlebots" itself is no longer on the air.


 

Originally posted by Mouse On Venus:
   Emphasis on the word "most".

Well yes, but I was pointing out why I felt your sweeping generalization earlier was a little unfair.  And "most" still means that the people who consider the current episodes (and not the older ones) to be mindless filler are in the minority.

[Reply #145 on:]

 

Originally posted by DotheBartman:
For the record "Diatribe" wasn't one of the better episodes emotion wise in this last sesaon. I enjoyed it for the humor...

 Humour-wise, there was some terrible barrel scraping in this episode. Homer's jerkass antics, his imitation of that balloon-man and his and Bart's eye movement thing showed signs of desperation for laughs. That said, I thought "Boris' Car Loft" was genius. Thank Jean they still do the old sign gags! 


 

...but I'd definitely suggest something like "The Way We Weren't" or the excellent "My Mother the Carjacker" over it.

 I'll look out for the repeats. Or let Uns tell me when they occur. :P

   

As for "I-D'oh-Bot" I don't think that episode was trying to be particularly satirical, so much as it was just putting a new spin on the Homer/Bart dynamic. And I think robot competitions and so forth do still exist (including shows dedicated to them) even if "Battlebots" itself is no longer on the air.

 Even so, it helps for the episode to be of its time, although maybe by then they thought they'd done so many episodes it didn't matter what time period the new ones occupied. One of the better stories though.

[Reply #146 on:]

They seem to be relying on pulling up old jokes. They actually use Dolph's name for the first time in many a season, and Lisa calls Skinner "Armand Tamzarian". Horrible, IMO

[Reply #147 on:]

 

Originally posted by Mouse On Venus:
Humour-wise, there was some terrible barrel scraping in this episode. Homer's jerkass antics, his imitation of that balloon-man and his and Bart's eye movement thing showed signs of desperation for laughs.

I'd agree that many of Homer's scenes weren't great (mostly in the subplot), but I wouldn't define any of his behavior as "jerkass".  Even when he's chasing down Flanders, he's never intentionally trying to hurt anyone or anything.  I'd say the problem was more along the lines of a....shall we say, "Captain Wacky" mentality, where we're just supposed to laugh at his ker-azy antics.  Not particularly well done (again, in the subplot anyway) but there wasn't anything that I would define as jerkassy.  In fact I should note that Homer's one of the most consistant characters on the show these days in characterization.  If there's a character they still sometimes struggle with (including in "Diatribe" ) its actually probably Marge.

 

They seem to be relying on pulling up old jokes. They actually use Dolph's name for the first time in many a season, and Lisa calls Skinner "Armand Tamzarian". Horrible, IMO

Ya know, back in season eight they brought back Ms. Botz for a small joke when she hadn't even appeared since season one (and hadn't even been referenced since, I'd say, season three).  That's just one of many, many examples too.  And as for the two things that you listed:  The first hardly amounts to criticism.  They mentioned a bit characters' name, whoopty doo.  That happens all the time, and the only reason he hadn't been mentioned by name for a while is that he's a bit character who doesn't appear very often (in any season) to begin with.  As for the Armin Tamzarian thing, that was the point.  It was supposed to be a call back to a long forgotten similar "cop out" on the show, that hardcore fans could laugh at.

[Reply #148 on:]

Can I ad anything worthwhile to this thread? No.

I'm simply going to state that I do believe that the show's gone on long enough.
Quite simply, I just don't find it funny anymore.

Oh, sure, I'll give it the odd smirk, and even on rare occasion I'll laugh out loud. But when I get the same amount of enjoyment out of this show as I do when I watch, say, Everybody Loves Raymond (not that I watch it regularly. Or even particularly enjoy the show), then I come to the sad conclusion that the show's barely worth my time anymore.

It makes me even sadder when the old eps are show every day at 6, so I can compare. Yes, I probably shouldn't be setting my standards so high. But tough. I'm not expecting it to be as good as it used to be. I am expecting it to maintain a certain standard.

"I'm Arnie Pie with "Arnie in the sky!"

[Reply #149 on:]

Well MOV Sky scheduling of new episodes has gone AWOL that is to say there hasn't been new episodes scehduled for ages. I belive The last new ep aired in May (Millhouse doesn't live here anymore) and there appears to be no new ones planned in August or september. (Though the U.K release of the season 4 DVD is on 2nd August If your looking for a fill of simpsons )

For me The best of the 12 S15 eps aired so far in the U.K are 'The President wore pearls' as There's certaintley a degree of intellegence and Inventivness that goes into writing a full blown musical parody.
and 'Tis The Fifteenth season' gets a lot of credit at the NHC though I don't see what the fuss is about personally.

season 14 eps you may or may not find interesting are.
Moe Baby Blues
C'E'Doh
Mr Spritz goes to washington
Special edna
and possibly 'Scuse me while I miss the sky' or Bart of war.
Most of these episodes I found got a lot better on 2nd viewing. Although you probably wont want to be doing that. and I doubt any of them will air for a while since they were only recently repeated.
 

[Reply #150 on:]

Personally, I'd say the best episodes this season are "My Mother the Carjacker", "Simple Simpson" and "The Way We Weren't", although the ones you suggested are quite good as well.

[Reply #151 on:]

from http://www.jumptheshark.com/s/simpsons/simpsons11.htm

First of all, I loved the Simpsons. I was in college when it started and a friend skipped all his Thursday night classes and got an F just so he could watch with the rest of us. We were pretty fanatical. We also didn't own a VCR. Through ten solid years, up till the 98 season, it remained my favorite show. So I hate to have to say this, but it has jumped the shark. Some people posting here have asked where Itchy and Scratchy have gone. Now I didn't like Itchy and Scratchy, I would usually leave the room or close my eyes while it was on because it was just too gruesome for me. But I did "get" it. It was a parody of all the one-dimensional cartoons that use sick humor and violence to get the lowest common denominator of viewers laughing. It was funny. But it was the kind of cartoon that the Simpsons definitely WASN'T. We watched the Simpsons because they made us laugh, yes. But we also watched them because they made us think. Their parodies - often scathing, but always dead on - made us reexamine our own hypocrisies. Their characters - often dumb, often making mistakes, but loveable nonetheless - were people we cared about. And yes, as they themselves put it on one episode, Simpsons violence DID have consequences. No matter how much fun the writers made of the Simpson family, the people of Springfield, and the fans, we always got the sense that they had a lot of affection for all of us. Now we have people getting mutilated on the show? Their fingers, arms, and legs being cut off? Maude is killed for ratings? Folks, the reason there is no more Itchy and Scratchy on the Simpsons is because the Simpsons have BECOME Itchy and Scratchy. And when a show that prides itself on its scathing satire actually BECOMES the very thing it parodies, it has definitively "Jumped the Shark." Of course we still laugh at it. Springfieldians thought that Itchy and Scratchy were a laugh riot. But when that's all it makes us do, there is something very important that has been lost. And I think that's sad. And for those of you who, reading this, are foaming at the mouth and getting ready to type YOU SUCK YOUR A LOSR IF YOU DONT LIKE THE SYMPSONS THAN YOU JUST DONT GET IT DUM IS FUNNY DUM SI FUNNY DUM SI FUNY then all I have to say to you is, Gee, I guess you've made my point. Having said that, I have to thank Matt Groening, and everyone who made the Simpsons, for ten solid years of unbelievably good entertainment. The Simpsons DID rock, and we are forever indebted to you for that. Thank you.

[Reply #152 on:]

 

Originally posted by John Pannozzi:
I was in college when it started.
.
.
Now I didn't like Itchy and Scratchy, I would usually leave the room or close my eyes while it was on because it was just too gruesome for me. 

I never liked Itchy and Scratchy either...it was the dumbest and most pointless part of the show in my opinion.

[Reply #153 on:]

He's made a good point though, Killing off Maude felt like a very desperate ratings move.

[Reply #154 on:]

Itchy and Scratchy gave us many marvelous moments of merriment, such as Reservior Cats, the 'Kennedy' one, the one where God crushes Scratchy, 'My Bloody Valentine', and much much more. A pox on it's haters. A particularly virulent pox, with welts the size of doorknobs. Oh my.

[Reply #155 on:]

Itchy and Scratchy are the highlight of the show 

[Reply #156 on:]

Itchy & Scratchy can make an otherwise crap episode worth watching...

[Reply #157 on:]

John why did you bump this thread for an incredibly pointless and outdated argument.

No one is arguing that the Maude Flanders things is acceptable none of us liked that.
But it was almost 5 years ago, it was season 11 under Mike Scully not Al Jean when your criticising the show for things that happend then its irrelervant now.
And The gory humour has dercreased and there has actually been quite a few Itchy and Scrathy's recently.

You also say 10 solid years, but seasons 13-15 are better than s10 you seem to have enjoyed the show more when it was worse.

[Reply #158 on:]

The problem with the "Jump the Shark" site (and to be clear I do like the site) is that most comments for any show are going to be inheritely negative.  People post comments to share when they think a show jumped, and generally not to say that a show hasn't jumped at all.  Only a show with a particularly large faction of huge fans will say it "never jumped".  Just look at the "South Park" page or the "Futurama" page as well.  All pretty negative.

The other problem, in the case of The Simpsons, is that while there's a fairly large group of fans who think the show is on the upswing, that page doesn't reflect it.  Frankly, the page has been around since season 9 I think, so negative comments made during the Scully years can't be taken back (at least without adding a new comment) and I can also tell that a lot of the commenters gave up on the show even before the Scully years ended.

Plus, quite frankly, its the internet and thus there's plenty of pretty dumb comments/votes there.  "Lisa's Wedding" as a jump the shark?

Again, I like the site....but I'd never use it to gouge general fan opinion.  Not by a long shot.

[Reply #159 on:]

The same goes for the iMDb, as well. As a rule, on the internet, fans of something will gravitate towards sites dedicated towards it, whereas detractors will gravitate towards sites which deal with the general subject.

As for the topic, I keep swinging backwards and forwards. Sometimes I think the show should be dropped immediately, and other times I think it should be allowed to regain a little more dignity.  I certainly don't think it should go on past 2006. A lot of the things which I take issue with the show nowadays probably will never go away, because they're regarded as "progress". 

On the other hand, I still take issue with that annoying statement "It's still the best show on TV". To me that's beside the point.

Oh, and my greatest criticism of Al Jean is that he didn't immediately declare Seasons 10-12 as "non-canon".  I doubt there'd have been THAT much resistance.