At Long Last Leave! - The Simpsons

[Reply #360 on:]

I'm a bit worried as to what the show's legacy will even be at this point.

I'm assuming the legacy will just be that It went on for a really long time. It sucks to think that it won't be remembered by everyone as the classic, hilarious show that seasons 1-9 presented.  

TOPTD

[Reply #361 on:]

Another possibility is Bart doing something in a Simpsons episode within the Futurama universe that causes controversy and leads to a bad future, and Bender somehow traveling back in time and into the Simpsons fictional universe to kill Bart in order to fix the future.

I see you also read the plot for the episode.

Yes, I have. But Al Jean only explained that Bart does something that makes future very bad. To me, he made it sound like both shows are set in the same universe, even though they're not. That's why I think that The Simpsons itself causes problems in Futurama's universe.

They did something similar in the comic crossovers. I've never read them, but I'm given to understand that the Futurama characters were accidentally transported into a Simpsons comic book.

[Reply #362 on:]

So I recently decided to at least try to catch up on The Simpsons, ever so slowly, although it's going to be extremely painful. I have through season 13 on DVD and have seen all of them numerous times so I started with season 14. Right now I'm about halfway through season 15 and I have to say that most of these episodes are pretty damn good. I have a newfound appreciation for a lot of episodes that at the time of airing I didn't think were that good, but in retrospect they have good stories, some classic jokes, and even some decent emotional moments.

Season 15 is definitely better than 14. I stick by my assessment that season 14 is probably the worst of the first 15 seasons. That said, it isn't that bad...in fact there were only two episodes that I would identify as being truly awful and cringeworthy throughout, which would be Strong Arms O The Ma and Barting Over. My five favorites of the season are probably How I Spent My Strummer Vacation, Bart Vs. Lisa Vs. The Third Grade, Special Edna, I'm Spelling As Fast As I Can, and C.E. D'oh.

When I'm done with season 15 I'll have a top five and worst episode list.

[Reply #363 on:]

I personally thought that season 13 was an improvement over seasons 11 and 12. It wasn't as good as the first ten seasons (which are pretty much the only seasons I ever watch anymore), but it did have some decent episodes. But that's probably because it was the first post-Scully season. After four seasons run by Scully (the second two being pretty bad), The Simpsons was in desperate need of a change in show runners. But I still wish that Mike Reiss had returned to run the show with Al Jean. As far as I know, he's working on the show, but at a lower position that show runner.

[Reply #364 on:]

No problem! Just remember these vital rules of PEEL

• Try to not get into arguments and especially try to not argue with PEEL veterans

I really enjoy breaking the last rule.

[Reply #365 on:]

I think these stunt crossover episodes with FUTURAMA and FG might attract viewers... but will ultimately hurt these shows more than they think.

[Reply #366 on:]

Short of them making a pro-KKK episode, it'd be pretty much impossible to do any more damage to The Simpsons at this point.

[Reply #367 on:]

Short of them making a pro-KKK episode, it'd be pretty much impossible to do any more damage to The Simpsons at this point.

Man, people at Peel sure hate the newer Simpsons. Look-I'm not gonna say it's as good as the old ones, but there are some great ones. Heck, I really enjoyed To Cur With Love-and a lot of other ones this season.Sure it's not as good, but that's how most shows are after a lot of seasons.

[Reply #368 on:]

No, but seasons 1-9 was some of the smartest, funniest material ever put to television. You may be a bit too young to be truly aware of this show's influence, but it completely reinvented scripted comedy as an art form, not to mention pioneering the idea of an animated show made for adults. It stopped being clever shortly after that, but at least seasons 10-16 still provided frequent laughs. Now it's become so hammy and badly-written, I struggle through most episodes. Side characters that used to bring a glee-filled smile to my face as soon as they showed up now just make me groan when I see them, because I know they're just going to do "their bit" which we've seen a hundred times now, and walk off without adding anything. A show that was once pushing all boundaries now remains inside an incredibly soft "safe zone" 99% of the time, all the while doing stories we've already seen, jokes we've already heard and ultimately no longer making a show where I give a rat's ass about anything that's happening. To fully appreciate seasons 1-9, you have to watch it with the mindset that there was NOTHING else like this show at the time.

I understand that nothing is ever going to be as good as it once was after being on the air for 25 years, but ultimately, nothing SHOULD be on the air for 25 years. For this show to go out with a perfect legacy, it would've had to have ended at season 9. For this show to go out not QUITE on top, but still with a fair amount of credibility in tact, season 15 or 16. We're past the point where the number of bad episodes outweigh the good, on a show that was once probably the most significant accomplishment in television of the past few decades. I grew up with this show, and I still have some memories of watching classic-era episodes for the first time when they came out. Each terrible new episode that comes out is like a small punch in the gut to me. I mean, at this point, the smallest victory we can hope for is that the last episode doesn't completely suck. It's heart-breaking how far the mighty has fallen.

[Reply #369 on:]

Exactly.


It's not just people at PEEL, either. I'd say it's the vast majority of people in the world, honestly. Pretty much every single human being I know in real life that has watched the show in any real capacity thinks that the show used to be great (even if they didn't really follow it), but that the new episodes are embarrassing.

The only exception to this rule are the younger siblings of some of my friends, who were, at the time, still children, around the age of 8-10. And to be honest, most of them have probably grown to a point where they hate the new episodes, too, by now.

I'm genuinely always amazed when I encounter people on the internet that still like the show and think of it as anything more than utterly awful. Not because they hold such a different opinion to me; but just because it feels like completely accepted fact in "real life" that the show stinks, now.

Obviously, there's a bias given the sorts of people that I associate with probably lean towards having a certain taste, but this distaste for new The Simpsons goes far beyond my friendship group.

In fact, if anything, I'm more positive than most people I meet in day to day life when it comes to The Simpsons. I remember having countless conversations with co-workers where I used to work where I'd be arguing that The Simpsons was one of the greatest pieces of TV ever made and they'd always say it was awful now as if that somehow erased the wonder years. I'd have to remind them that the show used to be good, and they'd always agree with me when they actually stopped to think about it, but they'd been so put-off by the new seasons that they'd actually forgotten that they even liked the show at all to begin with.


And the thing is that when most great shows start to go downhill, they're still great TV. Season 8 of The Office was the worst thing the show had done to date, but it was still one of the best sitcoms of that year and provided some great laughs and entertainment. Season 16 of South Park was terrible by South Park's standards, but I can still sit and watch almost all of the episodes and enjoy them. Hell, I've been one of the most vocal detractors of season 7 of Futurama on here, and I'll happily admit that the vast majority of it still makes for wonderful television, even if it is a shadow of its former self.

But The Simpsons transcends that. The modern episodes are truly abysmal. I think that  the difference here is that most shows hit that point and then they're usually cancelled or they decide to call it a day and walk away with their heads held reasonably high.

I think that, arguably, this point that happens for most shows, happened on The Simpsons at around season 9 or 10, but instead of it being cancelled or them moving on, they just kept on with it, and here we are, 150% of the show's then-lifetime, later.
 
I genuinely think that seasons 13, onwards, of The Simpsons are downright appalling. They're not just bad by The Simpsons' standards, but they're genuinely awful to the point that I cringe at practically every word that's spoken. They might squeeze one or two passable jokes in per episode, but due to the show's quickfire nature, those good jokes are gunned down by about 20 jokes so utterly terrible that it makes you want to scream.


I'm still watching the show out of morbid curiosity (I did stop watching after season 13 or so, but I wanted to catch up on my Simpsons lore and forced myself to sit through the 7 or so seasons I was behind with) after a while because I'm a massive nerd who watches loads of films and TV.  

I honestly don't derive any pleasure from watching The Simpsons after season 13, with the exception of about 5 episodes. But I stick with it because I want to know what happens; the same way that I'm still compelled to watch Under the Dome, despite it being laughably poor.

[Reply #370 on:]

I would rank seasons 15 and 16 well above 10-14 (17 onwards ranges from below average to utter garbage), but other than that, I agree.

[Reply #371 on:]

16-19 were pretty crummy, but even they had a handful of great episodes, I can't remember anything pleasant from the last 3-4 seasons

[Reply #372 on:]

Episodes I don't outright despise from season 13, onwards:

Season 13:
Treehouse of Horror XII

Season 14:
Treehouse of Horror XIII

Season 15:
n/a

Season 16:
Future-Drama
Thank God It's Doomsday

Season 17:
n/a

Season 18:
Springfield Up

Season 19:
n/a

Season 20:
n/a

Season 21:
n/a

Season 22:
Angry Dad: The Movie

Season 23:
Holidays of Future Passed

Season 24:
n/a

So, even I'd agree that season 16 is something of a highlight from the show's shitty years.

[Reply #373 on:]

I've been rewatching season 16, and I can totally understand why that's the point I decided it became almost unwatchable for me. I don't know how any of you can place it over anything that came before. Even seasons 13-15 for me actually have an abundance of hilarious jokes and actually decent plots.

Season 16 is where it becomes frequently cringeworthy, the plots pretty much all become either overly ridiculous or complete rehashes, and the guest appearances (with celebrities playing themselves) started always completely dominating episodes instead of just being jokey cameos you could ignore. It was almost as if they wanted to make the entire season an event season and pulled out all the stops hoping to draw more viewers, but instead of making the show funnier or more interesting, it makes it feel forced and cold. But my main complaint is that the occasional laughs just aren't there anymore. Even the episodes that aren't cringeworthy or have simpler plots just aren't as funny as episodes from previous seasons that were more ridiclous and took more chances.

Also, there's a distinct change in the animation at season 16. I can't exactly place what it is but the character designs seem frequently off and it looks really bizarre to me. I know the animation started changing like this a lot earlier in the show, but this is the point where I really started noticing it, as if the animators weren't trying that hard to maintain a consistent look anymore. It bothers me, but again, not as much as the lack of decent jokes.

So ya, I definitely think season 16 was the weakest season of the show up to that point. Sorry Beamer.

[Reply #374 on:]

No, you're entitled to your opinion, and I completely understand where you're coming from. My justification is, 16 may be far from perfect, but it made me laugh more frequently than 10-14, and I didn't actively hate any episodes from it like I did with those seasons.

16-19 were pretty crummy, but even they had a handful of great episodes, I can't remember anything pleasant from the last 3-4 seasons

The Book Job from season 23 is easily the best thing the show's done since the classic era. I also really loved The Day the Earth Stood Cool from this most recent season, too.

[Reply #375 on:]

I thought that "The Book Job" was far less awful than usual for the show, but it was still mediocre at best, and that's being very, very generous.

"Holidays of Future Passed" is the only episode that I'd say has been genuinely good in the last 8 years.

I think it's mostly down to the stupid, whacky nature of the show (nowadays) being far more forgivable in an episode set in the future where it's questionable if it's even canon.

[Reply #376 on:]

I remember like 2 years back, I decided to watch The Simpsons Seasons 1-10. They were actually really great, and I know why people used to love it so much back then.

When I got around to watching some of the newer episode, the episodes really, aren't that great. I kept skipping ahead of them (yeah, I watched them illegally. Leave me alone!) I don't like any of them at all. They don't represent what The Simpsons used to be. It just sucks. There's always like a couple episodes from the newer seasons that I thought were okay, (The Treehouse of Horror and Valentines Day episode from this season was pretty okay, but still mediocre) but none that were really good.

The last good episode for me was "Holidays of Future Passed". It was pretty darn good. It was well-done. I liked the family picture montage, it had that Classic Simpsons-ey feel to it. The Future Gags weren't that bad, either. There could have been some improvements made to it, but I'm pretty happy with what we got. It's sad to see that they just don't know how to keep the program at it's game. let alone quit making it.

I'll agree, watching The Simpsons nowadays is just embarrassing. They're never really good anymore. And everybody I seem to meet kind of looks down on it, because of how outdated and crappy the show has gotten. But it still beats Family Guy, in my opinion. I mean I'm glad that they didn't stoop so low for jokes that they made fun of people with serious diseases that just aren't funny.

[Reply #377 on:]

I thought that "The Book Job" was far less awful than usual for the show, but it was still mediocre at best, and that's being very, very generous.

"Holidays of Future Passed" is the only episode that I'd say has been genuinely good in the last 8 years.

Ehh, The Book Job is some of the sharpest satire the show's done in years, it's funny the whole way through, the heist movie parody is fantastically done, and it's full of great lines.

"Dad! Follow that dinosaur!"
"I've waited my whole life to hear that."

"Is R.L. Stine here? Because you just gave me goosebumps."

"British Fonzie is right!"

"Hey, if you don't want your words changed, write a screenplay. We own your book!"

"You switched the drives?"
"I got the idea from every movie ever made."

And, of course... "Kansas City."

Holidays of Future Passed is certainly one of the more noteworthy episodes of recent times, but it still didn't engage me the way The Book Job did... Any episode set in the future will always be in the shadow of Lisa's Wedding.

[Reply #378 on:]

I don't find any of those jokes funny.

[Reply #379 on:]

I'm with cyber_turnip.

Sorry Beamer. Simpsons lost the comedy it used to have a LONG time ago. Every now and then we'll find a half-decent joke (I liked the vodka and mayo one. Pretty funny, but how long ago was that?).

[Reply #380 on:]

I'm with cyber_turnip.

Sorry Beamer. Simpsons lost the comedy it used to have a LONG time ago. Every now and then we'll find a half-decent joke (I liked the vodka and mayo one. Pretty funny, but how long ago was that?).

Season 22, Episode 3: "MoneyBART". That was almost three years ago.

[Reply #381 on:]

I've been watching season 16 and it's been tolerable I suppose, but then I got to Homer and Ned's Hail Mary Pass and I forget how much I disliked that episode. Oh ya, and then Pranksta Rap. And then There's Something About Marrying. Ugh.

[Reply #382 on:]

There's Something About Marrying was quite good up until the whole "Patty's lover is actually a man" twist. Then it became fucking unbearable. I enjoyed the last half of Pranksta Rap purely because of how out-of-hand the story became; that was a fun episode. Homer and Ned's Hail Mary Pass was pretty crappy though, for sure. Still, "season 16 bad" is nothing to compared to "current seasons bad."

SolidSnake - I agree for the most part, though I found The Book Job to be a particularly clever/stylised episode that was actually trying something outside of the box as far as The Simpsons normally goes. I rarely laugh at new Simpsons anymore, but all the lines I quoted cracked me up (that, and "I'm sorry your book lady turned out to be a dinosaur," which is even more fantastic out of context). Oh well, each to their own, I guess.

Still, the fact that we all disagree so much on specific episodes from the post-classic era, but all unanimously agree the show's quality has been at an all-time low for the past several years now, pretty much drives home the point we were making to cartoonlover27 earlier: It's hardly just the view of a few select individuals.

[Reply #383 on:]

It also reminds me how many incredibly random jokes/quotes from the first 10 seasons that so many people make/get. Even if people are watching newer episodes, nobody's going home with anything

[Reply #384 on:]

Best quote of the past 10 years:

(Lisa walks in on Marge squeezing ketchup packets into a bottle)
LISA: Mom, what are you doing?
MARGE: This is how I save money on ketchup and mustard.
LISA: Do you do it with relish?
MARGE: No, I'm kind of embarrassed about it.

[Reply #385 on:]

I was just looking on The Simpsons wiki (Haven't looked on here in ages), and I found out that there is going to be another Future-based episode called "Days of Future Future".

The Synopsis for the episode is that "30 years from now, Jenda is dating a crab-like alien creature and she's still not getting along with Bart. Bart is trying to get over his divorce and he does it in a bit of a Total Recall-type way. Homer keeps dieing and becomes a hologram".

After reading that it's basically going to parody Total Recall, my excitement for the episode went away really fast. I just know they're going to overdo the parodying Total Recall, and it's going to suck just as bad as past episodes from Seasons 11-24.

Another episode that caught my attention though, is one called "The Man Who Came To Be Dinner", which involves The Simpsons family actually going to Kodos and Kong's planet. And it's going to be written by Al Jean.

Edit: Above, I  mistaked the Vodka + Mayo joke for the "Help me, Mayo!" joke. The "Help Me Mayo!" joke was the last good memorable joke I remember from The Simpsons, the Vodka + Mayo one sucked after seeing it again, to be honest.

[Reply #386 on:]

Another episode that caught my attention though, is one called "The Man Who Came To Be Dinner", which involves The Simpsons family actually meeting Kodos and Kand, and going to their planet. And it's going to be written by Al Jean.

Oh no, that sounds terrible, almost as terrible as Lady Gaga episode. Well, it could be basically good (or bad, however you interpret it), but not as it's mixing canon and non-canon, making outer space travel in canon episode. I don't know...

Also it's said in Wikipedia that "This episode was previously going to air as the finale of Season 24, but was moved to Season 25 for unknown reasons."

[Reply #387 on:]

I just found it interesting because it's actually going to be happening in a canon episode, instead of a non-canon short. Plus, Al Jean hasn't written for the show since Season 12 (according to the wiki), so it may turn out to be pretty decent.

[Reply #388 on:]

I thought that the episode was going to start with the family going to an amusement park and getting into a space simulator, which implies that it won't be any more canon than "Lisa's Wedding" was.

Edit: The plot synopsis I found was:
"The Simpsons go to Dizzneeland where the lines for the rides are terrible, except for this one rocket called "Journey to Your Future" that takes them to the home planet of Kang and Kodos, Rigel VII where the inhabitants try to eat Homer in a giant fondue."

That sounds like the rocket won't actually be taking them to another planet, if you ask me. It'll all be part of the ride.

[Reply #389 on:]

I still disagree with them using Kang and Kodos anywhere outside of the Treehouse of Horror episodes.

[Reply #390 on:]

I could have tolerated Kang & Kodos popping up in the background of the movie somewhere, because the movie has special rules - but I don't think they made anything close to an appearance, did they?

I'm also fine with Kang & Kodos appearing in Simpsons video games, but that's basically it.

Basically, anything non-canon, and the movie is special because it's a celebration of the show.

[Reply #391 on:]

I could have tolerated Kang & Kodos popping up in the background of the movie somewhere, because the movie has special rules - but I don't think they made anything close to an appearance, did they?

There were pictures of them in the credits, indicating they were intended to be in it but were written out (I believe there's also a picture of Patty and Selma in the credits for Julie Kavner, but their parts were cut too); all the other images are character shots taken from the movie itself.

[Reply #392 on:]

I could have tolerated Kang & Kodos popping up in the background of the movie somewhere, because the movie has special rules - but I don't think they made anything close to an appearance, did they?

There were pictures of them in the credits, indicating they were intended to be in it but were written out (I believe there's also a picture of Patty and Selma in the credits for Julie Kavner, but their parts were cut too); all the other images are character shots taken from the movie itself.

I read somewhere, most likely on the Simpsons Wiki, that Sideshow Bob was originally going to have at least one scene in the movie. I checked to see if it was in the Deleted Scenes section of the DVD, but Icouldn't find it anywhere. Have any of you guys seen it?

Oh, and on the topic of the Kang and Kodos episode...

The Simpsons visiting Kang and Kodos in a canon episode? *Facepalm*

That's the biggest 'Screw-You' to the fans of a series since......since...
....holy crap, that the biggest 'Screw-You' I've ever heard of!

[Reply #393 on:]

Screw you, Re-Post. Screw You.

[Reply #394 on:]

Screw you, Re-Post. Screw You.

Why should you screw my repost when I could screw my own repost?

[Reply #395 on:]

Fair enough. But I'm not gonna nominate you for Re-Post of the Month.

[Reply #396 on:]

I'd vote.

I read somewhere, most likely on the Simpsons Wiki, that Sideshow Bob was originally going to have at least one scene in the movie. I checked to see if it was in the Deleted Scenes section of the DVD, but Icouldn't find it anywhere. Have any of you guys seen it?

The writing process, I think, was very long and lots of stuff was changed during it, so it was probably cut out early.

I could have tolerated Kang & Kodos popping up in the background of the movie somewhere, because the movie has special rules - but I don't think they made anything close to an appearance, did they?

There were pictures of them in the credits, indicating they were intended to be in it but were written out

Kang and Kodos were supposed to be in credits critizising, but it was changed.

[Reply #397 on:]

Fair enough. But I'm not gonna nominate you for Re-Post of the Month.

Why should you nominate me for Re-Post of the Month When I could Nominate me for Re-Post of the Month?

I could have tolerated Kang & Kodos popping up in the background of the movie somewhere, because the movie has special rules - but I don't think they made anything close to an appearance, did they?

There were pictures of them in the credits, indicating they were intended to be in it but were written out

Kang and Kodos were supposed to be in credits critizising, but it was changed.

Funny, they did that for the credits of the game The Simpsons: Hit and Run. I wonder why they didn't make it into the movie?

[Reply #398 on:]

I thought the movie was canon. But I might be wrong....

[Reply #399 on:]

I thought the movie was canon. But I might be wrong....

No, it's canon. Spider-pig has made a couple of cameos in the series since.

But, if they did keep it in as an "underneath the credits" sequence, I doubt many people would've complained. The credits don't have to be canon.