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Author Topic: AL3?  (Read 8734 times)
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Oni Zyxer

Bending Unit
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« on: 03-14-2003 10:42 »

In 'Less Than Hero' you may have noticed the new eye chart in Zoidberg's office, (not the one that says 'No Squinting Four Eyes') but can't be seen too well because Fry and Leela are sitting in front of it. I can't check at the moment, but I'm pretty sure that same chart is in Futurama Comics #10. Last time I was reading it, I counted the characters, it doesn't have enough symbols to match the old chart. It seems like a very Futurama Comicish thing to do to try and bring the new language into the comic, and it seems likely that this is AL3. Somebody check if the charts are the same.


FUTURAMA WILL BE RENEWED.
Lee Roberts

Liquid Emperor
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« Reply #1 on: 03-18-2003 04:19 »

Emma here,good,good,any thing better,no fields!
Pittzoid

Bending Unit
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« Reply #2 on: 03-18-2003 04:28 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by Lee Roberts:
Emma here,good,good,any thing better,no fields!
what?!?
well anyway im interested to find out about AL3. hopefully it'll be better than AL2, i never liked that.


Carbito

Starship Captain
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« Reply #3 on: 03-19-2003 05:19 »

Lee Roberts what do you mean by "Emma here"?

Anyway, it would be cool if there was a third alien language!
winna

Avatar Czar
DOOP Ubersecretary
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« Reply #4 on: 03-23-2003 19:55 »

I thought it was kinda stupid to have 2 in the first place.... I WASNT told about two, I was only told about one.......
aslate

Space Pope
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« Reply #5 on: 03-23-2003 19:59 »

There was a thread somewhere about an AL3, it was to do with Leela's Homeworld and her bracelet.
SpaceCase

Liquid Emperor
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« Reply #6 on: 03-27-2003 03:59 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by aslate:
There was a thread somewhere about an AL3, it was to do with Leela's Homeworld and her bracelet.

Correct. Here it is, if anyone cares a rip: http://www.peelified.com/cgi-bin/Futurama/3-000166/

A question for the group:
I just saw Leela's Homeworld for the first time: The last post to the above-referenced thread was 2-28-02. Are there any further developments regarding AL3?
  confused
TheLesbianLeela

Liquid Emperor
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« Reply #7 on: 04-09-2003 22:01 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by Carbito:
Lee Roberts what do you mean by "Emma here"?
Emma is Lee Robert's sister.

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JDHannan

Bending Unit
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« Reply #8 on: 04-10-2003 02:42 »

In the dvd audio commentary they state there is a third alien language which is (something like) algorithmically more complex or something.
McGrady

Bending Unit
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« Reply #9 on: 04-10-2003 12:26 »

No they didn't.
Teral

Helpy McHelphelp
DOOP Secretary
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« Reply #10 on: 04-10-2003 15:23 »

Yes, they did. David X Cohen mentioned it in SP3K.

It was "computationel more difficult", not "algorithmically more complex".
McGrady

Bending Unit
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« Reply #11 on: 04-10-2003 15:45 »

No they didn't.  David Cohen said, "... So we later introduced a second alien language that was much harder to translate, and uh, people finally got it...  yeah they got it, it took a few months.  We may have to do a third one that's computationally difficult to translate."
Teral

Helpy McHelphelp
DOOP Secretary
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« Reply #12 on: 04-10-2003 15:54 »

::checks DVD commentary::

You win this round, McGrady.

Yet, the writing on Leela's bracelet might be the first clues to the new language. May indicates a possibility.
McGrady

Bending Unit
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« Reply #13 on: 04-10-2003 15:59 »

I agree there could be an AL3 in production season 4 and the comics, I was just stating that he didn't confirm they had made an AL3 at that point (post season3, pre season4)
payn
Bending Unit
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« Reply #14 on: 05-01-2003 22:13 »

You know, David X. Cohen doesn't seem to realize that the reason AL2 took us a few months is that it took us a few months to see enough of it.... We needed the Yummy/Tummy pillars as well as the chat room door before it was really crackable. Then we got it in a few days. So it's really his fault (or Fox's) that it took so long.

And I think we're in the same situation right now. Whether Leela's bracelet or Zoidberg's new eye chart is AL3, or even if they both are (I don't remember what the new eye chart looks like), that's not enough to crack it. We either have a handful of letters, some partially-obscured, or just three letters.

Also, keep in mind that there have already been a bunch of symbols in Futurama that are neither AL1 nor AL2 (nor English nor Hebrew nor Chinese). Take a look at the extra signs in My Three Sons; they're apparently just random doodling designed to look like an alien language, and they're every bit as detailed as Leela's bracelet. The same is true of everything that appeared to be AL3 pre-4acv, probably.

Also, from what Cohen said, we can make two inferences:

1. The new language is going to be computationally more difficult--not linguistically.

2. Someone read all of the ideas that we came up with in solving AL2. Which could mean they're not going to do something we've already considered, or it could mean something we considered inspired them....

Anyway, I'm pretty sure that AL3 is a complex cipher for normal English in the usual Roman alphabet. In particular, I don't think it will be a syllabary (like Japanese kana), or ideograms or pictograms (like hieroglyphics or Chinese), or even a different alphabet (like IPA).

My guess is that AL3 will be more contextual--that is, each plaintext letter's information is spread over the whole ciphertext string (or over a block of eight characters). That's the traditional next step in making a more difficult cipher.

By the way, I suspect that Leela's bracelet is not AL3 for her initials, but some made-up language that was never designed. And it could just as easily be a syllabic spelling of her first name ("T<schwa>" "r<ah>n" "g<ah>" ) as her initials.

The eye chart could be the first clue, but remember that our first glimpse of AL2 was a complete phrase, relatively easy to read from a frame grab (the "codebreakers chat room" )--almost, but not quite, enough to break it easily.

So, it seems a bit odd they wouldn't do that again with AL3--they obviously want use to spend frustrating months trying to crack it, rather than just sit around waiting for the clues to come in.

Oh, and for anyone who's reading that old thread, the different dialects of Chinese all use the same characters for the same meanings, but pronounce them differently. Japanese also uses a couple thousand of those characters as "kanji," with almost the same meanings but different pronunciations (in addition to the two kana syllabaries, and "Romanji," the Western alphabet).

By the way, I am 95% sure that the AL3 idea was mentioned in an interview before the DVDs came out, but I'd still guess that AL3 will only appear in 4acv (if at all).

Finally, going through all the "other language" citings on the Bender Bending Rodriguez site, here's some comments:

First, I used to know Japanese reasonably well (although I haven't used it in about a decade), so I may be able to tackle some of the  Chinese and Japanese signs.

The Chinese characters in the pilot across from the Akbar sign are "fire" and "woman." In Japanese, this wouldn't mean anything, but I suspect that in Chinese the sign says "hot women hot women hot women," which makes obvious sense.

During the New Years' countdown, I don't think that's Japanese. The second character appears to be a kanji made up of the "stride" and "cloth" radicals, and there is no such kanji, as far as I know. Either I'm wrong, or it's a Chinese character that the Japanese never borrowed.

The writing in Kyoto in 3acv22, by contrast, is definitely Japanese, as it contains hiragana as well as kanji. If someone has a better scan, I could translate them.

I haven't looked at hieroglyphics since college, but I do know that the writing on the coffins in 1acv03 are nothing like actual hieroglyphs. They're probably just random doodles designed to look vaguely Egyptian and vaguely alien/futuristic at the same time.

However, the algebra in 1acv06, the sign in 1acv07, and the various signs in 3acv17 all have at least some real hieroglyphs. I suspect that they're all random hodgepodges of hieroglyphs from different eras and squiggles that look sort of hieroglyphic and don't mean anything, but I could be wrong.

I think everything in the 2acv09 field of billboards is in English. The email message may actually have meaningful AL2 in it; has anyone tried to translate it?

JDHannan

Bending Unit
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« Reply #15 on: 05-06-2003 14:40 »

in the countdown at new years, they scream "woo" which is chinese (which dialect i dont know, maybe both) for 5, and i think its in the right place
ooy

Professor
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« Reply #16 on: 09-17-2003 02:49 »

woo, is spelt WU. come on! i leqarn year 7 chinese!!! still cant trannslate amys swearing, cant ask my teacher. ::shuDders::
Bender22

Delivery Boy
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« Reply #17 on: 09-17-2003 05:14 »

Thank you, payn. Tomorrow I'll bring you the DVD grabs of 3ACV22
VPActionRanger

Bending Unit
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« Reply #18 on: 09-17-2003 15:22 »

what did the AL2 chatroom door say?
Bender22

Delivery Boy
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« Reply #19 on: 09-18-2003 04:05 »

It said "CodeBreakers ChatRoom". Well, here are the grabs:
 http://usuarios.lycos.es/benderbending/otros/otros_3ACV22_1.jpg
 http://usuarios.lycos.es/benderbending/otros/otros_3ACV22_2.jpg
 http://usuarios.lycos.es/benderbending/otros/Bitmap9.jpg
 http://usuarios.lycos.es/benderbending/otros/Bitmap13.jpg

Moreover, there is a Slurm Ad. Does it say Slurm?
Arpgme

Delivery Boy
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« Reply #20 on: 12-29-2005 22:20 »

 http://www.futurama-madhouse.com.ar/alien/2acv09/sign3_h.jpg
 http://www.futurama-madhouse.com.ar/alien/3acv02/sign3_h.jpg

 http://www.futurama-madhouse.com.ar/alien/4acv02/sign2.jpg

They are all in AL3 I hope this help you crack it!
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