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Author Topic: Leela's Homeworld errors  (Read 2541 times)
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Allen

Professor
*
« Reply #80 on: 02-23-2002 17:28 »
« Last Edit on: 02-23-2002 17:28 »

Could it be that we're all over analyzing this? In the big scheme of things, the question is what to do now. Someone reminded us that mutants are not sociably acceptable. The question is what would happen if the world discovers she is a mutant? Although we've seen freakish things in this society, most are banned to the sewers. So like I said, what now? Does she deny her parents' existence in public? Would she have to relinquish her award?

:Top of the Page Dance:  smile
Venus

Urban Legend
***
« Reply #81 on: 02-23-2002 17:49 »

she'll probably have to deny her parents existence in public. Not because she's embaressed by them but because if she were banished to the sewers it would mean that the sacrifice her parents made for her would have been for nothing which would upset her parents, who obviously hated having to miss the first 20+ years of her life.
McGrady

Bending Unit
***
« Reply #82 on: 02-23-2002 17:55 »

I wonder about that little girl in the orphanarium with the ear on her head; will they cut off the ear and call her normal, or banish her, or is it not a big enough mutation to banish her?
Venus

Urban Legend
***
« Reply #83 on: 02-23-2002 17:57 »

i was wondering about Sally. You would think she would be picked up for being a mutant by now
Moonside

Delivery Boy
**
« Reply #84 on: 02-23-2002 18:11 »

If you worry about mutants too much, you have to get into weird genetics issues. I guess Sally there could've just mutated by chance, rather than be mutated by chemicals as seems to be the case with the sewer-mutants. I guess anything's possible in the future. The obvious question is indeed why she hasn't been sent to the sewer after all. Perhaps it was already known that her parents weren't mutants before they died? Maybe they _were_ mutants who tried the same ploy as Leela's parents, but no one's ever referred to Sally as an alien, so I doubt it. So yeah, I'm figuring known human parents, ordinary birth defect.
Kryten

Space Pope
****
« Reply #85 on: 02-23-2002 22:37 »

Or maybe they think she's an alien, too.
BrainSluggo

Starship Captain
****
« Reply #86 on: 02-23-2002 23:57 »

Just a good concept in a very badly-finished episode. The script of "Homeworld" needed one or two more drafts.

What freaks me out is trying to decide if that very last shot--at the end of the flashback/song sequence, with one of the sleeping adult Leela's parents popping out of an air duct and, um, petting her--comes before or after the main events of the episode. It means the difference between "super-sicko" and "utterly puke-a-tronic."

(1) Leela's parents are still watching their grown-up daughter from air ducts and the toilet. She has no privacy whatsoever. That's messed up. Think see was whacked out by this situation before? Just wait.

(2) I assume the parents and Nibbler have an "arrangement;" otherwise, the second the tentacles came out of the wall and flopped onto Leela's bed, Nibby would have torn 'em to shreds. (Solution? Nibbler disappears for the length of the episode--AGAIN.)

(3) Leela goes back to the surface, while her parents go back to picking through her bowel movements for souvenirs--until sometime next season, when the subjugation of the mutants suddenly becomes an "issue" for Leela to champion. Maybe. (I call this "Shmi Skywalker Syndrome." Ten years to go back and free her? Creep.) GET A VIDEOPHONE.

(4) How long before Bender uses his knowledge of Leela's legal status for blackmail? ("I prefer extortion. The 'x' makes it sound cool.&quot wink

(5) Next big revelation: the single-eye thing is not a mutation--the sideways mouth and the tentacles are. Leela's parents ARE aliens--just alien mutants. Come on, what are the chances of the exact same mutation in a single member of both sexes--in THAT crowd? Leela's mutation is her barbed ovipositor.  smile La la.

"Heed your own advice once in a while and you won't come over as such an arrogant pr*ck."
Moonside

Delivery Boy
**
« Reply #87 on: 02-24-2002 00:31 »

Ahh, some good points.
 
Quote
Originally posted by BrainSluggo:
Next big revelation: the single-eye thing is not a mutation--the sideways mouth and the tentacles are. Leela's parents ARE aliens--just alien mutants. Come on, what are the chances of the exact same mutation in a single member of both sexes--in THAT crowd? Leela's mutation is her barbed ovipositor.   smile La la.


Insanely, I thought of that too. And now we get back into the confusing genetics. None of the other mutants seem to have kids, so we can't be sure just how these kinds of mutation operate...
McGrady

Bending Unit
***
« Reply #88 on: 02-24-2002 01:01 »
« Last Edit on: 02-24-2002 01:01 »

Leela said she wanted her parents to hold her and stroke her, well they at least stroked her.  More than anything, it was showing that they cared for her wellbeing.

Nibbler seems lives at the PE building, from what I can tell (never seen him in her apartment, or a kitty litter box in there).

I don't know if she is a mutant alien or not, I tend to believe she is a mutant human (her parents didn't deny her when she said "I'm not an alien?  I'm a mutant?"); I will stay open on this opinion as she could end up being a mutant alien.
Allen

Professor
*
« Reply #89 on: 02-24-2002 01:27 »

I think she's just a mutant. She has no extra anythings. Aliens usually do not look human (with the exception of Amy, but she was a human raised on Mars)
Venus

Urban Legend
***
« Reply #90 on: 02-24-2002 01:48 »
« Last Edit on: 02-24-2002 01:48 »

   
Quote
Originally posted by BrainSluggo:
What freaks me out is trying to decide if that very last shot--at the end of the flashback/song sequence, with one of the sleeping adult Leela's parents popping out of an air duct and, um, petting her--comes before or after the main events of the episode. It means the difference between "super-sicko" and "utterly puke-a-tronic."

Yeah, that scene weirded me out as well.It was sweet in a way, but also kinda creepy

(1) Leela's parents are still watching their grown-up daughter from air ducts and the toilet. She has no privacy whatsoever. That's messed up. Think see was whacked out by this situation before? Just wait.

Just watch them never address this issue ever

(2) I assume the parents and Nibbler have an "arrangement;" otherwise, the second the tentacles came out of the wall and flopped onto Leela's bed, Nibby would have torn 'em to shreds. (Solution? Nibbler disappears for the length of the episode--AGAIN.)

i REALLY wondered about this. The whole time during that scene i was expecting Nibbler to respond, i think the writer completely forgot that he existed, that seems to happen a lot. He wasn't in parasite's Lost either and i'm sure he lives at her apartment seeing that she is the only one that likes him. Either that or Nibbler is a really terrible watchdog


(3) Leela goes back to the surface, while her parents go back to picking through her bowel movements for souvenirs--until sometime next season, when the subjugation of the mutants suddenly becomes an "issue" for Leela to champion. Maybe. (I call this "Shmi Skywalker Syndrome." Ten years to go back and free her? Creep.) GET A VIDEOPHONE.

lol, i can fully see that happening. Except for the picking through the bowel movement thing. Im sure Leela will visit them regulary and bring them stuff without sending it via the toilet, and yes they definitely need a phone

(4) How long before Bender uses his knowledge of Leela's legal status for blackmail? ("I prefer extortion. The 'x' makes it sound cool."    wink

Give him time. He'll think of that eventually

(5) Next big revelation: the single-eye thing is not a mutation--the sideways mouth and the tentacles are. Leela's parents ARE aliens--just alien mutants. Come on, what are the chances of the exact same mutation in a single member of both sexes--in THAT crowd? Leela's mutation is her barbed ovipositor.     smile La la.

Completely possible i wouldn't be too terribly surprised if that issue came up




The last time i tried to kill myself was about an hour ago. I jumped off this really tall building. But i ended up doing a triple backflip and landing on my feet. No one saw it of course, except for two little kittens and one kitten turned to the other and said "See? That's how you do that."
MuscaDomestica

Professor
*
« Reply #91 on: 02-24-2002 01:52 »

Just saw second that emotion recently and have some anti-nits. One Raoul could have just grown an extra ear... who knows what is wrong either it is a new mutation or he paid one of those organ guys on the street so he could hear in Stereo. The extra ear has apeared on more then one other episode so it  fits the contintuity.
Also her parents in STE Are only seen walking up to listen to the big head guy's song, they probobly saw Leela and ran before she was offered as a snackrafice.
Allen

Professor
*
« Reply #92 on: 02-25-2002 18:34 »

Yeah, that makes sense
Future Angel
Bending Unit
***
« Reply #93 on: 02-25-2002 19:58 »

Okay, I'm only going to change the subject for a second.

Did anyone else see this mistake:

Bender picked up Fry and knocked out the window of Leela's parents house which they jumped through. Then later as Leela is chasing her parents the window is borded up. In my opinion there is only a few minutes time between these two events, certainly not enough time to board up a window...  confused
Allen

Professor
*
« Reply #94 on: 02-25-2002 20:19 »

Yeah, I saw that.
Kryten

Space Pope
****
« Reply #95 on: 02-26-2002 01:39 »

It's the future. They have windows that automatically board themselves up!
cellery

Starship Captain
****
« Reply #96 on: 02-26-2002 01:45 »
« Last Edit on: 02-26-2002 01:45 »

If they can have coffee mugs that put themselves back together, why not? Otherwise, there's always the wizard...    wink
Allen

Professor
*
« Reply #97 on: 02-26-2002 17:09 »

Besides, there were only two boards in the first place right?
BrainSluggo

Starship Captain
****
« Reply #98 on: 02-27-2002 02:11 »

Bigger problem: People (and bending units) can dump spitoons directly into their apartment. Personally, I would've boarded THAT up first.

Wait, I thought the only way to reach the surface now was by balloon!

...and speaking of the balloon, howcumzit people 1000 years from now will still remember Bart Simpson, let alone (poooooot) Garfield?

Gnip! Gararararararar!!

(Head sizzles and explodes.)

"Heed your own advice once in a while and you won't come over as such an arrogant pr*ck."
Kryten

Space Pope
****
« Reply #99 on: 02-27-2002 02:27 »

People 1000 years from now will remember the Simpsons because they'll still be on the air.
Alb

Crustacean
*
« Reply #100 on: 02-27-2002 10:32 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by Allen:
So expressing surprise at not being mutated isn't quite the same as getting the hint. She could have said: "The waters didn't mutate me, that must mean I'm a..."

I'll finish it for you. "that must mean I'm an alien".  smile Nobody knows how toxic waste affect unnown alien race, right?
Alb

Crustacean
*
« Reply #101 on: 02-27-2002 10:43 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by McGrady:
Bah, it's called incest.  Sure, 50% will die, and 25% will be screwed, but a good 25% of the children might live, and after a while, the species might be better, look at dogs =)

It's horrible, but that might be the only way...

The problem is that DNA defects are accumulated. I think that methods that allows to predict DNA incompatibility already exist. Genetic engeneering may do wonders in y3k.  smile
Alb

Crustacean
*
« Reply #102 on: 02-27-2002 10:56 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by Allen:
I think she's just a mutant. She has no extra anythings. Aliens usually do not look human (with the exception of Amy, but she was a human raised on Mars)

Hm. How much aliens have you seen so far? If one of the aliens you've seen looked exactly as a human, how can you determine that he is an alien?
Alb

Crustacean
*
« Reply #103 on: 02-27-2002 11:07 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by BrainSluggo:
(1) Leela's parents are still watching their grown-up daughter from air ducts and the toilet. She has no privacy whatsoever. That's messed up. Think see was whacked out by this situation before? Just wait.

(2) I assume the parents and Nibbler have an "arrangement;" otherwise, the second the tentacles came out of the wall and flopped onto Leela's bed, Nibby would have torn 'em to shreds. (Solution? Nibbler disappears for the length of the episode--AGAIN.)

...

(4) How long before Bender uses his knowledge of Leela's legal status for blackmail? ("I prefer extortion. The 'x' makes it sound cool."  wink

(5) Next big revelation: the single-eye thing is not a mutation--the sideways mouth and the tentacles are. Leela's parents ARE aliens--just alien mutants. Come on, what are the chances of the exact same mutation in a single member of both sexes--in THAT crowd? Leela's mutation is her barbed ovipositor.   smile La la.


(1) We've seen only 4 episodes of 'watching'. What if that's all?

(2) Nibbler is a pretty intelligent being, he belongs to nibblonean race. Why should he attack Leela's parents?

(4) Who said Leela don't have any dirt on Bender? One hand washes another ...  smile

(5) One eye - not a mutation? That's a strange idea. Mutations are not 'exacly the same', mom had tentacles and dad's mouth is vertical.  smile

I think that there were not major problems with logic in this episode. Besides, it's not a sci fi movie, right?

One strange thing: Bender used Fry to break the window, but was unable to move Leela. Well, he might just use all his cells on Fry.  smile
McGrady

Bending Unit
***
« Reply #104 on: 02-27-2002 12:09 »

Yeah I couldn't figure out if Bender being unable to move Leela was a joke.  In a tale of two santas, he actually was able to not only move a gigantic thick steel door, he was able to hurl Fry and Leela quite a distance.  He was able to pick up Fry in the Leela's Homeworld, and Bender has been shown bending an UNBENDABLE girder.

Leela would have to weigh several tons, and be made out of some sort of unbendable material -- that or Bender didn't just try very hard to move her.

Those mutants assumed Leela was an alien at first, and thought if she was an alien she would be mutated.

There was one race that looked human: The women from Amazon women in the mood, albeit 4 times taller.
Alb

Crustacean
*
« Reply #105 on: 02-27-2002 13:05 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by McGrady:
Those mutants assumed Leela was an alien at first, and thought if she was an alien she would be mutated.

There was one race that looked human: The women from Amazon women in the mood, albeit 4 times taller.

They might think so, but they couldn't be sure, they would 'beat her afterwards' like Bender if she didn't mutate. Besides, Leela supposed to be THE ONLY known cyclop, how could they know anything about her race?  smile

About 'looked human' - according to the quote 'aliens usually do not look human'. 'Usually' doesn't mean 'never', so this statement doesn't proove that Leela is not an alien. There might be all sorts of aliens, some of them might be humanoid.  smile
Moonside

Delivery Boy
**
« Reply #106 on: 02-27-2002 16:03 »

Refresh my memory, when she was born did anyone say anything about the eye specifically? Or did they just talk about how remarkably unmutated she was, which is what I remember (but my memory is awful)? You know the writers absolutely would play a trick like that. Just watch as her actual mutation turns out to be... a birthmark!  big grin
So help me, it makes some sense. I did wonder how it was that the alien language was completely unknown on Earth, yet a mutant knew it-- what chance at education would she possibly have had?
In any case, it's all idle speculation. I'll be happiest waiting to find out everything from the show itself.
Allen

Professor
*
« Reply #107 on: 02-27-2002 17:06 »

Well, I don't know why people still claim she's an alien. I'm certainly not disappointed either way. Moonside: They talked about how she had no extra anythings. Alb: That line was meant to REMAIN unfinished big grin Someone explain why they can't accept Leela as a mutant. It's like that song says "Get over it!" Still interesting idea.
Alb

Crustacean
*
« Reply #108 on: 02-27-2002 17:27 »

Moonside, I've seen it one more time and didn't found anything that contradicts to this theory.  smile Nice idea. Maybe writers just didn't want to cut an opportunity.

Of cause, if Leela is 'relatively normal' alien, the parents may give her some clues about the real homeword.  Well, that's really a speculation.  smile

Allen - I realize it, I just wanted to point out that there are at least two explanations, so Leela had a lot to think about.  smile Besides, she had to catch some suspicious mutants at that moment.  smile
Allen

Professor
*
« Reply #109 on: 02-27-2002 17:38 »

Yeah, ok, but we still have no proof that aliens aren't affected by the toxic water.
Moonside

Delivery Boy
**
« Reply #110 on: 02-27-2002 18:27 »

We have no proof on anything. I don't even necessarily believe or disbelieve everything I'm saying; it's just something worth thinking about.
Allen

Professor
*
« Reply #111 on: 02-27-2002 18:32 »

That's cool. And yes it is worth thinking about.
BrainSluggo

Starship Captain
****
« Reply #112 on: 02-27-2002 21:29 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by Alb:
(1) We've seen only 4 episodes of 'watching'. What if that's all?

(2) Nibbler is a pretty intelligent being, he belongs to nibblonean race. Why should he attack Leela's parents?

(4) Who said Leela don't have any dirt on Bender? One hand washes another ...   smile

(5) One eye - not a mutation? That's a strange idea. Mutations are not 'exacly the same', mom had tentacles and dad's mouth is vertical.

I think that there were not major problems with logic in this episode. Besides, it's not a sci fi movie, right?

No, "Futurama" is a cartoon. Every ep has things that appear and disappear or happen without reason or just don't make sense--Leela climbs into her uniform before joining Fry and Bender in the shower in "Love and Rocket" for example, even though they were in the middle of a potentially fatal crisis--and that's part of the fun. "Leela's Homeworld" has an overwhelming preponderence of errors and goofs and things that don't make sense, many of which are just sloppy, ill-considered writing. It's sweet to want to defend this ep to the death and all, but...

(1) The entire purpose of the final sequence is to suggest that Leela's parents have been watching over her her entire life. It's supposed to be "loving." But they had to find her any time she moved and know how long to wait until it was safe to "emerge." That requires regular surveillance--and a messed-up sense of what is, and is not, Sick.

(2) Because they're strangers to him. Strangers who like to stalk and touch his mistress while she's asleep, with appendages that don't exactly suggest a parental relationship. You belong to an intelligent race, too--what would YOU do if tentacles popped out of the wall one day and started fiddling with your mother or girlfriend while she was taking a nap? Damn straight.

(Hopefully, Leela has now introduced them all to each other, bought some phones, lectured Mommy and Daddy about respecting her privacy, and patched up the security leaks in her apartment. Nibbler DID eat another intelligent being in "Wizzin'," but that was just a dream sequence. I can't remember if the end of "The Day The Earth Stood Stupid"--with Leela lounging on her bed with Nibby--takes place in Leela's apartment or her quarters on the ship, but I can't believe she leaves him alone every night in the PE building with all the owl traps and rat poison--seeing as Bender tried to kill him once, Hermes has expressed an on/off loathing of him, and Zoidberg is even hungrier than he is. Nibby did lead her to work when she lost her sight, so he must live at her place.) 

(4) Leela stands to lose almost everything if Bender talks. Bender has nothing to lose but his life, and we first met him waiting in line for a Suicide Booth. One hand has a fifty-five page warrant and no shame.

(5) I was suggesting that Leela's parents are one-eyed aliens who have been mutated. Again, the odds of one member of both sexes having the exact same "one eye" mutation are slim, given that everyone else in Old New York appears to have different mutations unique to each individual. It is the sideways mouth and the tentacles that make Leela's parents mutants; I'm betting they or their ancestors came to Earth with the single eye already in place. (Further, most--if not all--of the mutations are "add-ons"--extra arm, eye, nose, ear, or gill--"replacements"--arm where ear should be--or deformities like the pig snout or the bulbous forehead. Aside from the octopus nee little blond girl--which is such an overwhelming bodily change that she's either lying or came from Farnworth's experiment-disposal system--these mutations don't cover the kind of "subtraction" the Turonga family trait would require.)

Just to play the other side of the track, a pre-emptive explanation: the mutants, having just recently been discovered as of "I Second That Emotion," have since moved as close as legally possible to the surface. That's why sewer covers lead directly to apartments now--that's some skylight you have there, folks--when the mutants used to be hard to find over a mile deep.

Question: What's Pig-Snout's name? (I'm assuming it was Raoul she married, since they were together at the end of "Love and Rocket." Unless she's a total mutant slut.)

"Heed your own advice once in a while and you won't come over as such an arrogant pr*ck."
Venus

Urban Legend
***
« Reply #113 on: 02-27-2002 21:48 »

pig snout girl is Violet, i think
Alb

Crustacean
*
« Reply #114 on: 02-28-2002 02:48 »

> Leela climbs into her uniform before joining Fry and Bender in the shower

She might have some reason we don't know - for example, she needed additional pockets. Not a defect.

> "Leela's Homeworld" has an overwhelming preponderence of errors and goofs and things that don't make sense, many of which are just sloppy, ill-considered writing.

Well, you can just list them, that's what this thread for, right? As far as I can see most of them can be explained.

> It's sweet to want to defend this ep to the death and all, but...

It's not sweet to look for contradictions to some wild assumptions about Futurama world.  smile If there is a real contradiction - prove it!  smile

I am not trying to defend it 'to the death', I just can't find what to defend from.  smile

> No, "Futurama" is a cartoon. Every ep has things that appear and disappear or ...

Well, 99% of wievers don't notice these inconsistencies. Working hard to satisfy 1% of extremely accurate wievers? I don't think it worths it.  smile They won't be happy anyway.  smile
Alb

Crustacean
*
« Reply #115 on: 02-28-2002 03:03 »

> (1) The entire purpose of the final sequence is to suggest that Leela's parents have been watching over her her entire life. It's supposed to be "loving."

That's your opinion about this sequence. This opinion has the same rights for existence as any other, but using it as a fact is a strange idea.  smile I may say 'The entire purpose of the final sequence is to suggest that Leela's parents didn't forget about her and visited her sometime (4 times, to be precise)'.  smile

> But they had to find her any time she moved and know how long to wait until it was safe to "emerge." That requires regular surveillance--and a messed-up sense of what is, and is not, Sick.

It's hard to speak about 'survelliance' basing on 4 cases.  smile 'any time she moved' - she didn't change apartments or job too often, it shouldn't be dificult. 'wait until it was safe to emerge' - view it again, they never planned to 'emerge'.  smile

> (2) Because they're strangers to him. Strangers who like to ...

They might introduce themself to him why Leela was working - that's what strangers do sometimes.  smile Otherwise everybody were strangers.  smile

> ... lectured Mommy and Daddy about respecting her privacy ...

They visited her in apartment once, I doubt she will complain.  smile
Alb

Crustacean
*
« Reply #116 on: 02-28-2002 03:08 »

> Nibbler DID eat another intelligent being in "Wizzin'," but that was just a dream sequence.

Right, a dream. We can ignore it safely.  smile

> I can't remember if the end of "The Day The Earth Stood Stupid"--with ...  so he must live at her place.)

I am not sure that "The Day The Earth Stood Stupid" wasn't a dream of some sort. Maybe Fry eaten something wrong.  smile
Anyway, it was at the starship.  smile
In "Parasites lost" there wasn't Nibbler in Leela's apartment. She may keep him in office. Parents may visit her only when Nibbler is in office, Nibbler may sleep at the moment ... I can offer a lot of explanations that don't contradict to the episodes we seen, but what's the point?  smile Definitely there is no problem with logic.
Alb

Crustacean
*
« Reply #117 on: 02-28-2002 03:10 »

> (4) Leela stands to lose almost everything if Bender talks. Bender has nothing to lose but his life, and we first met him waiting in line for a Suicide Booth.

Suicide booth is an attraction for Bender, they don't damage him. Bender afraids of death a lot. There are probably 'worse then death' punishements for robots, something really cruel and unusual.  smile Leela has nothing to lose except her life on surface and job - she can join her parents. She seems to be strong enough person to handle her problems.  smile

(5) I was suggesting that Leela's parents are one-eyed aliens who have been mutated ...

"the odds ... are slim" - it means that it still could happen, right? 'Unbelievable' things happen sometimes, otherwise they were 'impossible'.  smile Anyway, I think that both variants (human or alien mutant) are possible, there are no strong evidences

Hm, had some problems sending it, probably just too long. Sorry about flooding, everyone.  smile
BrainSluggo

Starship Captain
****
« Reply #118 on: 02-28-2002 03:26 »

Ah, well, if one takes all things utterly literally (except, selectively, whole episodes one doesn't care for--dismissed as dreams!), then you, uh, "win" the, um, "argument." (I guess all opinions are equal, but some are more equal than others.) Hip! Hip! Hooray! We're having a party in your honor, drop by!   big grin

(Seriously? I've got better things to do than play yes-it-is-no-it-isn't ping-pong with someone who can't/won't read. Byeeee.)

"Heed your own advice once in a while and you won't come over as such an arrogant pr*ck."
Alb

Crustacean
*
« Reply #119 on: 02-28-2002 05:11 »

> except, selectively, whole episodes one doesn't care for--dismissed as dreams!

I didn't dismiss it, I just said that it was strange. As you can see, I've told that 'it was at the starship' - that what you was wondering about.

> I guess all opinions are equal, but some are more equal than others.

I told that you opinion is ok, but it doesn't mean that script writers are just a bunch of morons, you just MAY be wrong. If it's too offensive for you, what can I do?  smile

> Hip! Hip! Hooray! We're having a party in your honor, drop by!

Great! Party! I like it!  smile

> I've got better things to do than play yes-it-is-no-it-isn't ping-pong with someone who can't/won't read.

I glad for you. I don't think that there were any 'ping-pong' from my side, I've given some explanations.  smile Some people may agree with you and some may not, not a big deal. Discussion is what message boards are all about.

You previous letters are rather long, so, I suppose you just have no arguments.  smile It's ok, nothing to be ashamed about.  smile Do 'the better things'.  smile
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