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Author Topic: [3ACV19] Roswell that ends well  (Read 2393 times)
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McGrady

Bending Unit
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« Reply #40 on: 12-12-2001 17:11 »
« Last Edit on: 12-12-2001 17:11 »

There is not enough known about time travel currently.  There are only two theories that have relavance to this topic:  divergent time streams, like different dimensions, or one time stream.  In the diverging time stream, anything can happen because one time stream does not effect the other stream; meaning you could travel back in time and kill your grandfather, and nothing would happen to you.  If however, there is only one time stream, then you could not kill your grandfather, as by doing so you wouldn't ever exist to kill your grandfather in the first place... meaning you try to kill your grandfather and something intercedes you.

I believe that, if fry is his own grandfather, it was meant to be (in the sense that, for him to be created, he had to travel back in time to have sex with mildred); if fry is not his own grandfather, then he didn't have to travel back in time and kill his grandfather (I mean, if fry is not his own grandfather, due to Enos(spelling is Ennis, I believe, I checked it out on the name your baby website) got mildred pregnant ahead of time, then he just had perverted sex with his grandmother).
Nixorbo

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« Reply #41 on: 12-12-2001 17:36 »

Hooray for hypothetical situations!
DrThunder88

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« Reply #42 on: 12-12-2001 17:48 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by McGrady:
I believe that, if fry is his own grandfather, it was meant to be; if fry is not his own grandfather, then he isn't.

I've kept up with you on everything so far, but this has me stumped.

No signature.
ShineyMetal@$$

Bending Unit
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« Reply #43 on: 12-12-2001 20:19 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by VelourFog:
 i have a question.  people always say this, that if one thing was changed the world would be all messed up.  But is there any reall proof to that?  I mean we can't prove if time travel even exists so how can we prove its effects?  Maybe fry was supposed to be his own grandfather all along.  ever thought of that?

No there's no proof. But think about the effects. Say you go back in time, and ALL you do is move a tree branch a foot.
ANYTHING COULD CHANGE. Maybe a guy would have tripped on the branch if you hadn't moved it, got a cut face, so went back to his house to clean it up.
But say you didn't move that branch, he wouldn't have tripped , and maybe as he continued walking, a girl passes him in a truck, and stops, and they talk, so he gets in, and they fall in love and have kids eventually.

Maybe this guy was your dad. and by going back in time, you change his whole life because he never met this woman and had YOU, and also since his life was different, maybe he met a different woman , that would have married someone else if you hadn't gone back. The possibilities are endless.

There's zillions and zillions of different  things that have happened to make the earth how it is today, and if you change one, BAM, it mushrooms and everything's different before you know it.

And about Fry suppose be being his own grandpa, thats just crazy talk, you should hold back on the vodka.

ow my fingaz are tired.  smile
iZac

Crustacean
*
« Reply #44 on: 12-13-2001 05:03 »

Yeah I think it was a loop, Fry was destined to go into the past and kill his grandfather and become his own grandfather. We know this was the real timeline that he came from because this was the whole Roswell U.F.O. cover up right?
     So Fry had to come back in time to become his own grandfather, otherwise he wouldn't have existed to be able to go back in time to become his grandfather to cause himself to exist in the first place.
     That's why a hole in space-time would have been created when he asked the what if machine what would have happened if he wouldn't have gotten frozen. See, he wouldn't have gone to the future to be able to go back in time to father his father... blah blah blah, all of history as we know it would be changed. Americans wouldn't have really gone to the moon,
(which we know had to have happened because they found the lander module on the moon, although it could have been planted there by the historical society that say it was "returned" to the moon ??? makes you think huh... heh heh)
And the professor probably wouldn't exist as he is a decendant of Fry... his nephew, the second Phillip Fry, wouldn't have been the first man on mars, as his nephew wouldn't exist as he was also his great-grandson. So with all these changes the universe would implode or whatever it did, I just don't know why Fry and the other nerds were left living if there was no universe, maybe God really does love him?
     Anyway, the whole idea was that it is the same universe, just in a loop, no history had been changed as it was destined to happen that way.
     There is a posibility that there are two timelines now but I don't think so because in both timelines there would be stories of a U.F.O. coverup in Roswell right? Or is the timeline they existed in before they went to the past one where there was no Roswell story??
     In the case that they did change history and create another universe, they wouldn't change along with the other universe as they are not in it at the time of the change, they would only be aware of the changes when they got back home and were able to compare how things were to them before they left, and how they are in the new universe, but I don't think that happened, nothing changed the timeline, that's why Fry didn't disappear right after he killed his grandfather.
     So anyway I am the expert on time travel, glad to have cleared this whole confusion up for you... Oh and about the Lincoln story, you had it all wrong, it was more like this:

    Lincoln invented a time machine before he died, he goes to the future to find out how he dies and finds out that John Wilkes Booth shoots him, so he travels to the past where Booth is a kid and gives him a bomb, this doesn't kill Booth so he travels a little farther to where Booth is a little older and trys shooting at him, this just scares him because he just runs away from Lincoln, and so Lincoln continues unsuccessfully to kill his assassin. He finally gives up and accepts his fate, so when he goes the Ford Theater that night Booth is there and sees Lincoln, this makes him snap and go after Lincoln and he shoots him.

The moral of the story is time travel is evil.
Of course this story isn't true, but it makes you think, huh? Doesn't it?? Well it should, you closed minded people with your starbux grande latte. Think a little for once!! The future is the first thing he saw and it was that he was assassinated by Booth, he tried to change it and in trying to change it, it actually caused for the thing to happen. I think that's more along the lines of the Fry is his own grandfather story... Well I think I got it right.

P.S. That brick story was moronic and pointless I don't see what it had to do with time travel at all. If you could explain it, it would be appretiated, but from what I read it needs no explanation it was just a moronic story with an extra brick.
Markild

Bending Unit
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« Reply #45 on: 12-13-2001 05:18 »

But how do you explain the part about Bender being left in the past. When they come back Bender's not there, which means that there are two different timelines. Bender's in Roswell in one of them (from ca. 2000-3000) and in the other one he's not even invende yet in 2000, and then later on, gets made (no.. not in 'bender gets made'), and then meets Fry and the rest of the bunch..

...even though I may be wrong! :P
Markild

Bending Unit
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« Reply #46 on: 12-13-2001 05:22 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by ShineyMetal@$$:
ANYTHING COULD CHANGE.

How can you say that? Nothing would change.. couse it's already been changed.. you see? let's think you're going to the past... you kill a man, and you may think that this affects the future.. It won't, cause was killed in the past before you went to the future, cause you were already going to go to the future...

Spookey that, ey?
DrThunder88

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« Reply #47 on: 12-13-2001 08:15 »
« Last Edit on: 12-13-2001 08:15 »

Since I took these as personal attacks, I'm going to be a little hostile in my rebuttal.

 
Quote
Originally posted by iZac:
Lincoln invented a time machine before he died...this makes him snap and go after Lincoln and he shoots him.

You arrogant so-and-so.  I know exactly which story I'm talking about.  You, on the other hand, just paraphrased the Terminator movies.

 
Quote
Originally posted by iZac:
P.S. That brick story was moronic and pointless I don't see what it had to do with time travel at all. If you could explain it, it would be appretiated, but from what I read it needs no explanation it was just a moronic story with an extra brick

I was pretty sure I pointed out that the brick story was not about time travel.  In fact I am certain that I made that abundantly clear.  It was merely a satirical display of my contempt for the notion of spontaneous and anomalous existence.  I suppose you might not have understood that either so I'll explain: me no like things that appear for no reason.  Should I draw it in crayon?

I usually try to keep myself above the level of using personal attacks, so I apologize if this causes anyone, particularly iZac, mental anguish.  I guess I just assumed that everyone would realize that the brick story was a joking counter-example, and the Lincoln story (however paraphrased..."bust a cap" was never actually mentioned) was a serious counter-example of another theory of time travel.  Once again, I apologize for bringing things down a level.  For all my attempts to be euphuistic, I can become lazy and rather stentorian when attacked.

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Nixorbo

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« Reply #48 on: 12-13-2001 09:35 »

iZac?  IZAC???  Apparently somebody's body wasn't disinegrated by the blast so he doesn't come back as a zombie.  Hoo boy.

Incidently, I'm not picking up any personal attacks in his post.  Somebody's a little oversensitive, m'thinks.
iZac

Crustacean
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« Reply #49 on: 12-13-2001 11:28 »

Wow, I didn't know anyone would be offended by that. Haha, that was pretty tame compared to what I'm used to, I didn't make any personal attacks, I could have though... I didn't understand the brick story at all and what it had to do with this whole thing and yes, I would like you to send me an explanation, preferably in crayon, as in my old age my eyes can't see small lines made by pen.
I also thought my Lincoln story was closer to the story you were TRYING to tell in the first place as you never told an actual story, I thought that might have been the story you were thinking of, I don't know what it has to do with the terminator movies though. Unless Lincoln was a killer robot, then that would be cool.
Anyway I have to get back to my delicious brains...
ShineyMetal@$$

Bending Unit
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« Reply #50 on: 12-13-2001 19:23 »
« Last Edit on: 12-13-2001 19:23 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by Markild:
 How can you say that? Nothing would change.. couse it's already been changed.. you see? let's think you're going to the past... you kill a man, and you may think that this affects the future.. It won't, cause was killed in the past before you went to the future, cause you were already going to go to the future...

Spookey that, ey?

Hhmmmm ya i see what you mean. Time sucks.
So based on what you're saying, and what i beleive,all the time travel that humans will do during their existence has already happened, in essence. I mean since the past is the past, it can't be changed, so if people from the future have gone to the past, they've made it what it is. OR option #2, There has not, and never will be time travel, except in the normal forward time.

I can't use words properly, consequently, that post probably made no sense. It's unfortunate we can't communicate thoughts directly as a wave into another persons brain.   sleep
Allen

Professor
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« Reply #51 on: 12-13-2001 21:07 »

I can't believe this! Doesn't anyone remember Back to The Future? If Enos WAS his grandfather, Fry would have faded away, which proves that in some strange, weird, and unexplainable way, Fry is responsible for his own existence. Also, back in the 40's wasn't premartial sex a no no? (with the exception of grandmother, but that was desperation and loneliness), but the main thing is it's a cartoon show. Anything can happen.
VelourFog

Space Pope
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« Reply #52 on: 12-13-2001 22:53 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by iZac:
P.S. That brick story was moronic and pointless I don't see what it had to do with time travel at all. If you could explain it, it would be appretiated, but from what I read it needs no explanation it was just a moronic story with an extra brick.

finally someone says what i've been thinking!
impact

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« Reply #53 on: 12-14-2001 18:15 »

too bad you can't talk for yourself...
Nixorbo

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« Reply #54 on: 12-14-2001 18:35 »

Yes, lets all attack the mods
Chump

Urban Legend
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« Reply #55 on: 12-14-2001 20:50 »
« Last Edit on: 12-14-2001 20:50 »

I was making a few pics of the episode and I thought I'd toss this into the mix. When the crew fired a missle at the base, the missle read on the side: Roswell That Ends Well, with a picture of Zoidberg on the side:
 

the only other episode to show the title is "Hell is other Robots" Here:
 

Interesting...

Edit: Almost forgot the shameless plug! You can find more tidbits like this on AU, that's Aliens Unlimited: http://aliens-unlimited.cjb.net
Nixorbo

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« Reply #56 on: 12-15-2001 02:09 »

Quick question:

Did the time tunnel remind you at all of the Bajoran wormhole?  Even just a little?  I think it had the same color scheme.
]PaulFSAC[

Professor
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« Reply #57 on: 12-15-2001 03:28 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by Nixorbo:
Quick question:

Did the time tunnel remind you at all of the Bajoran wormhole?  Even just a little?  I think it had the same color scheme.

The way the PE Ship blinked out of time, was very reminicent of the Babylon 4 time hop starting, from the series Babylon 5, the effect was nearly identical.

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[-mArc-]

Administrator
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« Reply #58 on: 12-15-2001 03:57 »

sure that was a wormhole from DS9. I mean, look how they get out of it and it spiralled just like that too (but for the pointy middle).
The Zapper

Crustacean
*
« Reply #59 on: 12-16-2001 04:58 »

You have to look at this paradoxon from a different angle.

assuming that it is possible to travel trough time and that einsteins theory of space and time "sticking" together is true, then there are two possibilties of travveling through time itself. One is that you grow older or younger if you travel to the future or to the past. That would mean that you wouldn't exist back in time, so you coulnd't kill your grandfather. This theory is used to explain why the digital chronograph turns into a pinup calendar.

The second theory is that, in order to travel through time, you have to travel on a level outside of time, and to stay on this level for the whole journey. if that is the right theory, then it wouldn't be possible for you to alter history. so decide for yourself what you want to believe!

personally, i think, that you must not see it that physically correct, and i go with farnsworths words, "choke on that, causality".

kind regards

your sexlexic captain  big grin

That's the law, Leela. And Brannigans Law is like Brannigans Love, hard and fast.
Just Chris

Urban Legend
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« Reply #60 on: 12-16-2001 23:32 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by McGrady:
I believe that, if fry is his own grandfather, it was meant to be (in the sense that, for him to be created, he had to travel back in time to have sex with mildred); if fry is not his own grandfather, then he didn't have to travel back in time and kill his grandfather (I mean, if fry is not his own grandfather, due to Enos(spelling is Ennis, I believe, I checked it out on the name your baby website) got mildred pregnant ahead of time, then he just had perverted sex with his grandmother).

That is a weird way to put it though. Even though the case of the PE ship being the cause of the Roswell conspiracy is a similar situation. So in that sense, the PE ship also needed to interfere with the past. However, this clashes with destiny and free will. I don't think time travelers would've been able to cause the events in history that we see now. If time travel one day is possible, we would need to hope that someone can go back to our time to prove it so.


B.Frankendorfer

Bending Unit
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« Reply #61 on: 12-20-2001 20:54 »

I wish I had read through all of this, but I'm too tired right now, so I'll just ask my question.  Couldn't Enis be Fry's grandfather on his mother's side and therefore we wouldn't have to worry about the fact that his name isn't Yancy? 

As for all the other time travel stuff, I dunno.  It was funny.  It made my brain hurt.  That's all I know.  wink
McGrady

Bending Unit
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« Reply #62 on: 12-20-2001 22:31 »

Fry said multiple times that Enus was his father's father ("It will be ok, Dad!&quot wink.  Also, the entire naming thing was, Fry's dad (Yancy) told Fry's brother (Yancy II), "Your name is Yancy (II, fry's brother), just like your father (Yancy, fry's dad), and your father's (Yancy, fry's dad) grandfather, and so on, all the way back to minute man Yancy Fry (I think the last name was fry, I could be wrong though), who blasted commies in the american revolution."

I still don't think fry is his own grandfather, as the dna tester in the first episode read fry as being farnsworths great (x20 or x30) uncle, rather than great(x22 or x32) grandfather... which would be a WAY closer match than a great uncle.
B.Frankendorfer

Bending Unit
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« Reply #63 on: 12-21-2001 07:18 »

Ahh yes, I forgot about that.  He did yell to his "dad" in Enis' crotch.  Unless Fry's just an idiot.  smile  Either way, I still thought it was great episode. 

Now if only they would air a couple more before the year 3002 actually arrives...  frown
Nixorbo

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« Reply #64 on: 12-21-2001 16:54 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by B.Frankendorfer:
Unless Fry's just an idiot

That's my theory

I have a thousand years of power.
"NOOOOO HE WAS MY BROTHER!" and then got tired and slept.


"He has the special talent, though, of being able to help people and make them feel utterly stupid all at the same time. ... In short, he's a great moderator, but a terrible human being."
-SlackJawedMoron
Shadowstar

Liquid Emperor
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« Reply #65 on: 12-29-2001 13:30 »

Wait a second, if Fry's dad said that his father (Fry's grandfather) was named Yancy and in 1947 Fry's grandfather was Enis and then it wouldn't make sense, so then Fry is now Fry's dad's dad and he'll have to be named Fry, and then Yancy will be named Fry and Fry will be named... [blows up]
RachTheAce31

Crustacean
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« Reply #66 on: 12-29-2001 16:13 »

Go, all you beautiful minds. Go use that thinking power to solve world hunger before I blow a gasket. 
cykelbudet

Poppler
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« Reply #67 on: 12-29-2001 18:15 »

Maybe the fact that Fry is is own grandfather was planned by the writers already from the beginning. In that earth-stupid episode we learned that Fry has a slightly different mind than everyone else which protected him from turning into an idiot by the brains. Perhaps there's a connection there.
meisterPOOP

Professor
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« Reply #68 on: 12-29-2001 18:26 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by Shadowstar:
Wait a second, if Fry's dad said that his father (Fry's grandfather) was named Yancy and in 1947 Fry's grandfather was Enis and then it wouldn't make sense, so then Fry is now Fry's dad's dad and he'll have to be named Fry, and then Yancy will be named Fry and Fry will be named... [blows up]
Musta' been from his mothers side.
Otis P Jivefunk

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« Reply #69 on: 12-30-2001 04:27 »

Welcome to PEEL cykelbudet, enjoy your stay.
Javier Lopez

Urban Legend
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« Reply #70 on: 12-30-2001 19:41 »

grrrr, i hate time paradox!!
Shadowstar

Liquid Emperor
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« Reply #71 on: 12-30-2001 20:08 »

Yeah, time travel is weird. Because if you go back in time and destroy your enemy, then he won't exist and you won't have anyone to brawl with, so you'd never have a problem in the first place and would never had... [blows up again] Eh, this joke gets old fast.
ShineyMetal@$$

Bending Unit
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« Reply #72 on: 12-30-2001 20:19 »

I think Fox is just trying to screw with everybody's brains til the point that our heads all blow up and nobody can watch, so they can finally get what they want, Futurama Off the Air.
Shadowstar

Liquid Emperor
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« Reply #73 on: 12-30-2001 20:21 »

It worked for me! But dispite my minor disability of being dead, I can still watch Futurama!
Nixorbo

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« Reply #74 on: 01-12-2002 11:10 »

Sudden revelation:

If Enos was really Fry's grandfather, Fry would have ceased to exist the moment Enos died.  Since he didn't, that leaves us with three possibilities:

A) Fry was always his own grandfather.
B) Someone else (besides Enos) was Fry's grandfather.
C) Mildred (or whatever her name was) was previously impregnated by Enos.
VelourFog

Space Pope
****
« Reply #75 on: 01-12-2002 13:15 »

dude.  Enos has the red hair.  Fry's mom has the red hair.  Fry has the red hair. 

Enos isn't called Yancy.  the phrase "all the way back..." indicates that every generation had a Yancy. 

Enos *is* on Fry's mother's side, which M.Poop already said, but I have just proved.  You are welcome.
McGrady

Bending Unit
***
« Reply #76 on: 01-12-2002 16:45 »

Yancy, fry's father, to Yancy, fry's brother:

Son, your name is yancy, just like your father, and your fathers grandfather, and so on.

Fry, to Enos: It will be ok, dad!

Both these situations occured.  Enos is not Fry's maternal grandfather; he is his paternal grandfather, as illustrated in the luck of the fryish and roswell that ends well.

At no time Fry's father implied that his father (fry's grandfather) was named Yancy; he stated it clearly (he did NOT say, "Son, your grandfather's name is Yancy".  He said, "Son, your father is named Yancy.  Your great grandfather is named Yancy, and everyone before your great grandfather was also named Yancy".)

The phrase, "and so on" is refering to everyone before Fry's father's grandfather, not from Fry's Father; The skip was intentional, and brought up to our attention so that we would know about it. Otherwise, he would have said, your name is Yancy, like your father, and your father's father, and so on; he would NOT have said your father, and your fathers grandfather.  The show stays extremely consistant.

Enos is definately not on his mother's side, for several reasons.  Fry's father is militarily minded, much like Enos; Mildred had the same hair color as Frys father, if you want to argue about hair color proving genetic decent.  The age of his father fits in nicely with the time of the episode (so does his mother, I admit... this is a weak argument).  There are several other reasons, but I can't remember them off hand.
Chump

Urban Legend
***
« Reply #77 on: 01-12-2002 17:38 »

 
Quote
Originally posted by McGrady:
At no time Fry's father implied that his father (fry's grandfather) was named Yancy; he stated it clearly (he did NOT say, "Son, your grandfather's name is Yancy".  He said, "Son, your father is named Yancy.  Your great grandfather is named Yancy, and everyone before your great grandfather was also named Yancy".)

Yes he did imply that his grandfather is Yancy. His exact words were:
"Son your name is Yancy. Just like me, and my father, and my father's father, and so on..."

That pretty much says it all.
The writers screwed up.
aslate

Space Pope
****
« Reply #78 on: 01-12-2002 17:44 »

Nope, sorry, it is actually
"Son, your name is Yancy. Just like my, my GRANDFATHER and so on, all the way back to ..."
Chump

Urban Legend
***
« Reply #79 on: 01-12-2002 17:47 »

I disagree!
Quote Nazi! Settle this pointless arguement!
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