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Author Topic: What is Season 6's most overrated episode?  (Read 2641 times)
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Inquisitor Hein
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« Reply #40 on: 09-18-2011 16:41 »

Quote
Overclockwise is definitely the most overrated ep of Season 6 to me. The whole Fry/Leela relationship was far too forced and unnatural, jarringly so as if it was taken from a bad fan-fiction.
The Leela/Fry thing in overclockwise lacked the usual sci fi plot.
In previous episodes, the love scenes alway did involve that sci fi twist.
E.g. TLPJF (trying to get in time to a date...ooooold. It grew interesting when time travel through the whole universe was involved).
TKOS (the endless chase, yet the timeskips did reveal suddenly that this chase could succeed...in fact, DID succeed.)
etc, etc, etc..

Leela should have left because of a sci fi based event, and returned because of another event (or the same with a different twist). That way, Overclockwise's handling of the Fry/Leela subplot would have fit in the show's tradition.

Having your relationship mapped out very accurately by a super-computer that can see the future counts as sci-fi in my book.

"Bringing that thing up randomly for the happy end's sake at last 1,5 minutes of the episode" might qualify as sci-fi, but hardly as plot.
Otis P Jivefunk

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« Reply #41 on: 09-18-2011 16:44 »

Yeah, that was more of an after-thought, for convenience as so much of this episode was written with adherence to...
spira

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« Reply #42 on: 09-18-2011 17:15 »

Yeah, Gorky, I agree with you and that's one of the reasons I liked this episode so much, but I also completely understand where all of the people who didn't like it are coming from when they complain about the abruptness and the lack of a sci-fi-ness. Pretty much all of the great Fry/Leela episodes involve the two of them in some crazy situation, which has always added some depth to their relationship and kept happy the people who are completely uninterested in the ship. In the parts of this episode that develop the F/L plot, a viewer who doesn't give a crap about their relationship has nothing else to enjoy (sure, the whole Bender-god thing is cool, which is why people still give the episode a 6/10 or whatever, but the Fry/Leela thing isn't tied into that context until the very end, and it's not a terribly satisfying connection, I have to admit).
Inquisitor Hein
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« Reply #43 on: 09-18-2011 18:23 »
« Last Edit on: 09-18-2011 18:27 »

Quote
I may be alone here, but part of what I loved about the Fry/Leela thing in "Overclockwise" was that it wasn't tied up in the sci fi craziness
Well...for me, it's some kind of tradition's sake.

The Leela/Fry stuff has ALWAYS been linked to some crazy sci-fi-end-of-the-universe-now-or-never stuff.  Exploring their relationship in a normal way (if done properly) is imhO rather something for a middle-of-the-season-filler episode.

But I expect a season's finale to be more classic regarding that matter. About the same way as a Zoidberg-based episode can be funny, but does not really qualify as a season's finale. The finale would require Fry, Leela and Bender as protagonists, the Leela/Fry relationship should feature that classical, traditional sci fi twist.

(Personal opinion, of course...)
Gorky

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« Reply #44 on: 09-18-2011 18:34 »

Fair enough. Don't get me wrong: I love episodes like TKoS and "The Sting" and Wild Green Yonder; they combine the Fry/Leela stuff with the sci fi story brilliantly. But the whole point of "Overclockwise" was that Leela was curious about what her day-to-day life would be like with Fry; she was wondering whether or not the two of them could manage in a real on-all-the-time relationship. And I think that's a very realistic concern a twenty-something woman could have, and I don't think the shippy stuff needed to be integrated in an overt way with the Bender/overclocking stuff. Sometimes it's okay to be down-to-earth. Maybe your quasi-series finale is not the place to go for the quieter, softer emotional stuff--but it worked for me.
Spacedal11

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« Reply #45 on: 09-18-2011 19:43 »

The next most overrated ep is Lethal Inspection, it seriously isn't that great. I don't find the back-story with Hermes and Bender all that touching. It didn't strike much of a chord with me. I feel almost alone in this. Anyway the whole Mexico thing bored me, it suffers from that taking the future out of Futurama thing again. As soon as an episode goes somewhere like that, visually uninteresting and not Futurama-y it lowers dramatically for me...

Thank you! I thought I was the only one who thought Lethal Inspection was overrated, and at that not a good episode. Don't get me wrong I don't have a problem with watching it but I completely agree with the whole Hermes/Bender backstory, the dull Mexico bits, and not only the lack of 'future' in it but the lack of any subplot. This would have been a great Fry-Leela-Bender episode but the inclusion of Hermes has never sat right with me. And I hate how this episode just eliminates everyone else with the exception of that stupid Leela subplot.
cyber_turnip

Urban Legend
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« Reply #46 on: 09-18-2011 22:55 »

I liked 'Lethal Inspection' but it's only with a lot of repeat viewings that I've grown to love it.
lilkitten29

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« Reply #47 on: 09-19-2011 04:48 »

I think the episode could have been a lot better if it was handled similarly to "Teenage Mutant Leela's Hurdles"; the crew accidentally having their Gender's swapped much earlier in the episode,  and the Prof trying to find a way to reverse it.

Exactly!
futurefreak

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« Reply #48 on: 09-19-2011 08:38 »

That saddens me Otis, we usually have similar opinions on episodes. I rather enjoyed Lethal Inspection, and the ending where it put all the clues together worked really nicely. And it put two characters who seemingly had nothing in common together in a wonderful momentary bond of friendship.

I didn't find The Prisoner of Benda to be that great, which I know makes me an outcast. The storyline was interesting I will admit, but the way it played out bugged me at some parts. Specifically Leela and Fry switching bodies and then screwing up the shippyness in the episode with stuff like "you don't find me attractive!" That is something for an established couple to be saying, not them where in previous episodes Leela seemed disinterested. I did enjoy Scruffy and his wash bucket though big grin 
winna

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« Reply #49 on: 09-19-2011 09:37 »

Part of the joke was that they were portrayed as a caricature of a well established couple that bitch at each other and comically play off of gender stereotypical behavior. roll eyes
futurefreak

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« Reply #50 on: 09-20-2011 03:27 »

It wasn't funny. no no It seemed cheezy considering that they were not an established couple already.
spira

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« Reply #51 on: 09-20-2011 05:26 »

I agree that the sudden seriousness of Fry/Leela in that episode was off-putting. But I did find it really funny, regardless. That episode isn't among my favorites, it's not even in my top 5 of Season 6. But it's pretty good. It's one of those with a lot going on, but I feel like the pacing was still good and they told a great story.

Maybe it is overrated - people do tend to rank it pretty highly. But I think it's mostly deserving of praise.
Inquisitor Hein
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« Reply #52 on: 09-20-2011 10:25 »
« Last Edit on: 09-20-2011 13:36 »

Personally, I didn't mind the established couple-bitching by Leela and Fry.
PoB was not the classical, "serious sci fi story with comedy elements" Futurama, but just sheer wackiness. Following the motto "If you wanna go stupid/crazy/silly, go BIG!!!"
The "You think my eye is too big" (Translation: "Do you think I look fat?", and we all know where these dialogs HAVE to lead to tongue ) hinted clearly from the beginning that this episode will be anything but subtle...

TbO usually gets high ranking by people considering it one of the funniest/craziest episodes. But for someone expecting Futurama's serious undertones, it usually cannot be a favorite.
winna

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« Reply #53 on: 09-20-2011 12:56 »

I think too many people enjoyed The Late Philip J Fry.
spira

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« Reply #54 on: 09-20-2011 14:15 »

Now that's one that pretty much deserves any praise that is lavished upon it.
DotheBartman

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« Reply #55 on: 09-20-2011 18:26 »

Even if you don't care about backstory, Lethal Inspection is a fantastic exploration of mortality and coming to terms with it. It has to be commended for that at the very least.

I didn't get all the hype for Law and Oracle. It was fine and certainly funny enough, but the pacing is ridiculous and the plot way too all over the place. Why it would be rated as one of the best 6B eps I don't quite understand.
DannyJC13

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« Reply #56 on: 09-20-2011 18:27 »

Why it would be rated as one of the best 6B eps I don't quite understand.

Cause it was hilarious.
Otis P Jivefunk

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« Reply #57 on: 09-20-2011 20:04 »

The next most overrated ep is Lethal Inspection, it seriously isn't that great. I don't find the back-story with Hermes and Bender all that touching. It didn't strike much of a chord with me. I feel almost alone in this. Anyway the whole Mexico thing bored me, it suffers from that taking the future out of Futurama thing again. As soon as an episode goes somewhere like that, visually uninteresting and not Futurama-y it lowers dramatically for me...

Thank you! I thought I was the only one who thought Lethal Inspection was overrated, and at that not a good episode. Don't get me wrong I don't have a problem with watching it but I completely agree with the whole Hermes/Bender backstory, the dull Mexico bits, and not only the lack of 'future' in it but the lack of any subplot. This would have been a great Fry-Leela-Bender episode but the inclusion of Hermes has never sat right with me. And I hate how this episode just eliminates everyone else with the exception of that stupid Leela subplot.

It's refreshing to see someone else who feels exactly the same way about this episode, hooray I'm not alone! smile...

That saddens me Otis, we usually have similar opinions on episodes. I rather enjoyed Lethal Inspection, and the ending where it put all the clues together worked really nicely. And it put two characters who seemingly had nothing in common together in a wonderful momentary bond of friendship.

Fair enough, I'm glad that people enjoyed it and everything. It didn't do much for me, but I can understand why some like because had it struck an emotional chord with me I may have been able to forgive the dull Mexico stuff. Oh well, we were never likely to agree on every ep, sad I know but that's life tongue...

I didn't get all the hype for Law and Oracle. It was fine and certainly funny enough, but the pacing is ridiculous and the plot way too all over the place. Why it would be rated as one of the best 6B eps I don't quite understand.

Very funny. Fry based, and a lot of NNY. All very good ingredients for Futurama. The Tron parody was great too!...
Gorky

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« Reply #58 on: 09-20-2011 23:13 »

Even if you don't care about backstory, Lethal Inspection is a fantastic exploration of mortality and coming to terms with it. It has to be commended for that at the very least.

Indeed. I love that scene between Bender and Hermes, where he's just punching the wall without knowing why he's doing it and lamenting his mortality. So well done. I think "Lethal Inspection" is easily one of the best episodes of season six, if not the series as a whole (it was easily the most pleasant surprise of 6A for me; based on the synopsis we got beforehand, I never would have guessed it would be so great).

And I haven't seen "Law and Oracle" since a week or two after its initial airing, so it's possible that I wouldn't enjoy it quite as much now as I did then. What I liked about it was how much better it was than freaking "Ghost in the Machines," so it may have just been a relativity thing for me.

And I think "A Clockwork Origin" is overrated. It's a perfectly average, pretty unmemorable episode, in my opinion.
DannyJC13

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« Reply #59 on: 09-20-2011 23:16 »

Agreed, 'A Clockwork Origin' isn't the best ep, it was good, but nothing memorable. I enjoy 'I don't want to live on this planet anymore.', the pineapple pizzas and the Professor's hut with all the random pianos in it. laff
cyber_turnip

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« Reply #60 on: 09-21-2011 00:13 »

I think 'A Clockwork Origin' is under-rated if anything. It's a great little sci-fi concept, full of lovely art-design and consistently one of the funnier episodes of season 6. It's probably my 3rd favourite episode of season 6, but I rarely see anybody think more of it than that it's reasonably average.
DotheBartman

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« Reply #61 on: 09-21-2011 02:00 »

A Clockwork Origin isn't perfect, but it's definitely a very clever, Futurama-ish exploration of evolution (and the controversy over it), and the satire is spot on. "We don't understand evolution, and we need to keep our children from understanding it!" The whole long ridiculous "ah, but what about THIS missing link" conversation between the Professor and the orangutan has come up in conversations I've had about the subject. It was another 6A episode that was if nothing else very ambitious (I feel 6B was slight lacking in comparison) and interesting thematically.

And by the way, I don't hate Law and Oracle; it certainly has a lot of funny moments (I was thinking of "congratulations on your big bust!" sporadically the whole next day and laughed every time). It's just very aimless and unambitious. Kind of the definition of a "just a bunch of stuff that happens" episode.
spira

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« Reply #62 on: 09-21-2011 04:36 »

I don't think I've ever seen anyone praise Colockwork Orogin very highly, so I can't really say it is overrated. I think it had some really exceptional animation and it was very fun to watch, plus it fit into the theme of traditional Futurama episodes. I think it is probably in the top half of Season 6 for me, but after the first five or six episodes and before the last three there is a whole jumble of above-average goodness.

Law and Oracle was funny, but I really didn't like the butch cop character and it was a bit unfulfilling. Good though. No real complaints.
Spacedal11

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« Reply #63 on: 09-21-2011 07:25 »

Even if you don't care about backstory, Lethal Inspection is a fantastic exploration of mortality and coming to terms with it. It has to be commended for that at the very least.

Indeed. I love that scene between Bender and Hermes, where he's just punching the wall without knowing why he's doing it and lamenting his mortality. So well done. I think "Lethal Inspection" is easily one of the best episodes of season six, if not the series as a whole (it was easily the most pleasant surprise of 6A for me; based on the synopsis we got beforehand, I never would have guessed it would be so great).

I think this is why the Hermes/Bender story didn't do anything for me: so Bender is now mortal and could die. Well as an audience member I know that that just isn't going to happen. The death of a main character in the show has to be done carefully, ala "The Sting" which as it turns out, didn't actually happen. Here though you know because it's Bender a). One of the main characters and b). Bender, that he just isn't going to die. If this were Battlestar Galatica or some series drama, sure anything is possible. But this is a Matt Groening universe where every episode pretty much goes back to status quo regardless of what's happened. So Bender might die, sure, but not in the series' lifetime.


And I think "A Clockwork Origin" is overrated. It's a perfectly average, pretty unmemorable episode, in my opinion.

This however, I agree with 100%. I remember reading the thread for ACO and seeing all the great remarks and comments about it, and I thought it was a very average episode. However I think I am in the minority who found season 6B to be better than 6A.
DotheBartman

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« Reply #64 on: 09-21-2011 10:25 »
« Last Edit on: 09-21-2011 10:28 »

Even if you don't care about backstory, Lethal Inspection is a fantastic exploration of mortality and coming to terms with it. It has to be commended for that at the very least.

Indeed. I love that scene between Bender and Hermes, where he's just punching the wall without knowing why he's doing it and lamenting his mortality. So well done. I think "Lethal Inspection" is easily one of the best episodes of season six, if not the series as a whole (it was easily the most pleasant surprise of 6A for me; based on the synopsis we got beforehand, I never would have guessed it would be so great).

I think this is why the Hermes/Bender story didn't do anything for me: so Bender is now mortal and could die. Well as an audience member I know that that just isn't going to happen. The death of a main character in the show has to be done carefully, ala "The Sting" which as it turns out, didn't actually happen. Here though you know because it's Bender a). One of the main characters and b). Bender, that he just isn't going to die. If this were Battlestar Galatica or some series drama, sure anything is possible. But this is a Matt Groening universe where every episode pretty much goes back to status quo regardless of what's happened. So Bender might die, sure, but not in the series' lifetime.

That's not the point of the episode at all though. It's not suggesting he'll die within the episode or series to begin with (well there are the typical scenes of the characters in peril, but those happen, like, every third episode anyway). It's a character study and an exploration of the very human issue of dealing with mortality. Everyone has that moment as a child where they realize that people die and that they, themselves, will die. Everyone has it in the back of their minds the rest of their life that their life is finite, and we all deal with that in different ways. This episode isn't trying to instill fear in us that Bender will die on screen, it's a lot deeper than that. If another sitcom did an episode about a child realizing they will eventually die obviously we wouldn't expect that the child would die within that episode (unless it was a very dark show, I suppose) but it could still be very interesting. "Lethal Inspection" is all about realizing one's mortality and coming to terms with it.
winna

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« Reply #65 on: 09-21-2011 10:31 »

The other emotional aspect was seeing Hermes and Bender connectively bonding on another level, and then tying that all together by way of showing Hermes as an empathetic and important figure in Bender's life all along.  I also really liked how they handled this because it didn't blatantly destroy canon for me (although seeing baby bender bot is certainly debateable).  All in all, this was a good episode in my opinion with a neat song at the end, mirroring it to some degree with one of my past favorites (The Luck of the Fryish).

Also, Clockwork Origin is one of the best episodes of post season 4 Futurama.  It introduces a new character that is awesome in every way: Dr. Banjo!?
JoshTheater

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« Reply #66 on: 09-22-2011 05:06 »

Here is my list of overrated episodes. They are not in order of how overrated they are, rather they are listed in the order they aired. I am basing this on the user ratings for the episodes on CGEF.

A Clockwork Origin

I actually don't think this one is THAT overrated. I enjoyed it. The concept was great, the beginning was funny, and the plot twists were fairly interesting. But for some reason I didn't find the majority of the episode funny. Something about how the characters acted didn't jive with me, perhaps.

The Mutants Are Revolting

Same case here as with the last episode actually. I liked the story, it just wasn't that funny for me.

Ghost In The Machines

Not a terrible episode, but I didn't find it particularly funny. I also didn't particularly care for how deeply Bender starts caring about Fry in the third act (to the point where he was trying to hug him), it seemed too out of character for me to accept. The two's friendship has been explored before in better ways, and Bender's way of showing how much he actually cares for Fry is usually less subtle, because he has a persona to uphold. The end of the episode also seemed pretty rushed to me.

The Silence Of The Clamps

This is definitely up there for most overrated of the season. There wasn't close to enough funny to make up for the horribly lazy story. I also just couldn't accept that the crew didn't recognize who Clamps was, even though they've definitely seem him before...including at the beginning of the episode! Seriously...what was with that?

Fry Am The Egg Man

It was the Simpsons episode Bart The Mother recycled almost plot point by plot point. And Bart The Mother was written by DXC. Also, it wasn't very funny.

Cold Warriors

This also wasn't particularly funny. And the flashback stuff between Fry and his father was lame and unoriginal. Especially the end scene felt ripped straight from an 80s family show.

Overclockwise

Overclockwise is definitely the most overrated ep of Season 6 to me. The whole Fry/Leela relationship was far too forced and unnatural, jarringly so as if it was taken from a bad fan-fiction. Too much time spent in court, especially considering that Judge Whitey's voice was so far off it ruined the experience. Then there's the fact that they tried to force too much into such a small run-time, no room to breathe, again making it seem forced. The Bender plot was great, should've just left the whole ep to focus on that and forget everything else, that would've been a lot better if you ask me. Either that or a two-part episode. I don’t get how this can all get overlooked so passively. Anyway, where was I? Oh yeah, overrated...

^This is exactly everything I kept saying in the review thread for this episode.

Reincarnation

I was surprised as hell at the rating for this episode...really? It wasn't as bad as the Holiday Special, for sure, but it still wasn't that funny at all. They spent all the time on the animation and forgot to spend any time trying to write it.


-------------


And that's that. Here's my list of episodes from season 6 that are NOT overrated:

Lethal Inspection

Hermes and Bender made an interesting pair. The story was well thought out, and it was funny throughout. The end was even somehow a bit emotional...even if the song they used was a bit of a stupid choice. This was the first episode that actually got me excited about the new season.

The Late Philip J. Fry

The best episode of season 6, and one of the best episodes of the series. Fantastic story, hilarious jokes, brilliant development of Fry and Leela's relationship. What more could you ask for?

The Prisoner Of Benda

One of the most rapidfire hilarious episodes of season 6, with a great story to boot.

Law & Oracle

Funny throughout, great story, you know the drill.

Möbius Dick

Ditto.
spira

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« Reply #67 on: 09-22-2011 05:50 »

A Clockwork Origin, Mutants are Revolting, Egg Man, and Cold Warriors are all high on my list, though I agree that none of them (with maybe the exception of Egg Man, which I thought was pretty funny throughout) are particularly funny. I think that personally, despite this being a comedy show, I don't consider amount of humor to be terribly important in my own rating system. It's certainly a bonus, of course, and all of those episodes have their funny moments. But Colockwork Origin had wonderful animation and was a pure visual treat, Mutants had the heart of old Futurama, and Cold Warriors had an excellent plotline (even if it was taken a bit from one of the comics - they reworked it enough to make it fresh). So all those qualities make these episodes stand out for me, despite them not having a huge level of funny.

This of course is not to say that your opinion is wrong or anything. I'd expect people to rate funnier episodes higher.

I thought Reincarnation was really funny, actually, with maybe the exception of the second segment. Even that was good though. I dunno, the anime especially had me laughing out loud.
JoshTheater

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« Reply #68 on: 09-22-2011 06:44 »

The anime part was the least funny for me, because it offered nothing new that pretty much any other anime spoof ever hasn't done in terms of parody.

Humor is the most important factor for me. It's pretty much the opposite for me than what you said...I watch Futurama because it's funny, and the great animation is a bonus.
Story is also extremely important to me, but I find that the story and the humor seem to be related. If the story is good, the humor works more and the jokes are more memorable. If the story is terrible, the humor tends to fall flat.
Spacedal11

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« Reply #69 on: 09-22-2011 06:50 »
« Last Edit on: 09-22-2011 06:51 »

Josh your avatar makes me want to punch you, namely because when I've read your posts lately I've been hearing that snide dorkly voice. And it reminds me of how much I wanted to punch that guy through the whole episode.

Regardless I don't like this comparison of Fry Am the Egg Man to Bart the Mother. Similarities aside, I did not watch that episode thinking, 'god what a rip-off of the Simpsons'. I mean I don't want to stifle creativity, but what hasn't the Simpsons already done? Isn't it inevitable that other shows are gonna have episodes similar to it, especially when they're shows of the same production team? Family Guy rips off the Simpsons all the time, mostly through their jokes. Now Egg Man may have a similar plot I didn't see it as using the same jokes or the same setting. I don't know if I'm making sense, but that complaint has bugged me so much.

Even if you don't care about backstory, Lethal Inspection is a fantastic exploration of mortality and coming to terms with it. It has to be commended for that at the very least.

Indeed. I love that scene between Bender and Hermes, where he's just punching the wall without knowing why he's doing it and lamenting his mortality. So well done. I think "Lethal Inspection" is easily one of the best episodes of season six, if not the series as a whole (it was easily the most pleasant surprise of 6A for me; based on the synopsis we got beforehand, I never would have guessed it would be so great).

I think this is why the Hermes/Bender story didn't do anything for me: so Bender is now mortal and could die. Well as an audience member I know that that just isn't going to happen. The death of a main character in the show has to be done carefully, ala "The Sting" which as it turns out, didn't actually happen. Here though you know because it's Bender a). One of the main characters and b). Bender, that he just isn't going to die. If this were Battlestar Galatica or some series drama, sure anything is possible. But this is a Matt Groening universe where every episode pretty much goes back to status quo regardless of what's happened. So Bender might die, sure, but not in the series' lifetime.

That's not the point of the episode at all though. It's not suggesting he'll die within the episode or series to begin with (well there are the typical scenes of the characters in peril, but those happen, like, every third episode anyway). It's a character study and an exploration of the very human issue of dealing with mortality. Everyone has that moment as a child where they realize that people die and that they, themselves, will die. Everyone has it in the back of their minds the rest of their life that their life is finite, and we all deal with that in different ways. This episode isn't trying to instill fear in us that Bender will die on screen, it's a lot deeper than that. If another sitcom did an episode about a child realizing they will eventually die obviously we wouldn't expect that the child would die within that episode (unless it was a very dark show, I suppose) but it could still be very interesting. "Lethal Inspection" is all about realizing one's mortality and coming to terms with it.

The other emotional aspect was seeing Hermes and Bender connectively bonding on another level, and then tying that all together by way of showing Hermes as an empathetic and important figure in Bender's life all along.  I also really liked how they handled this because it didn't blatantly destroy canon for me (although seeing baby bender bot is certainly debateable).  All in all, this was a good episode in my opinion with a neat song at the end, mirroring it to some degree with one of my past favorites (The Luck of the Fryish).

I see where you two are coming from, I see that in the episode, but the episode just did not have that effect on me. I watched it three times in a row and never liked the episode any more or less.

Dr. Banjo is pretty funny. I also liked Pickles from Law and Oracle.
JoshTheater

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« Reply #70 on: 09-22-2011 07:06 »
« Last Edit on: 09-22-2011 07:34 »

Regardless I don't like this comparison of Fry Am the Egg Man to Bart the Mother. Similarities aside, I did not watch that episode thinking, 'god what a rip-off of the Simpsons'. I mean I don't want to stifle creativity, but what hasn't the Simpsons already done? Isn't it inevitable that other shows are gonna have episodes similar to it, especially when they're shows of the same production team? Family Guy rips off the Simpsons all the time, mostly through their jokes. Now Egg Man may have a similar plot I didn't see it as using the same jokes or the same setting. I don't know if I'm making sense, but that complaint has bugged me so much.

So basically, if you use a different setting and different dialogue, it's okay to completely recycle a story's premise, almost all of its plot turns, and the emotional responses of the characters? And not subconsciously, but rather while fully aware of the thing you're recycling from? And that's not at all lazy? [/snide dorkly voice] tongue

Sorry, I'm not having it. Everybody who's told me that they don't mind the similarity between the episodes isn't someone who even realized it before I pointed it out...which means they didn't remember that Simpsons episode enough for it to pop into their brain. As someone who was completely familiar with that Simpsons episode, for large parts of Fry Am The Egg Man I felt like I had already seen what I was watching, which should not have been the case. You shouldn't recycle a plot simply because you figure most of the audience won't remember or know what you're recycling.

For the record, a reminder of how similar the plots are:
Quote
In both episodes, Fry/Bart decide to hatch an egg/s. The thing/s that hatch unexpectedly turn out to be a dangerous creature/s that prey on other species, but Bart/Fry continues to love it/them anyway. Everyone tries to hunt the creature/s while Bart/Fry tries to protect them/it. Then when the creature/s are finally released into the wild, its preying on other creatures turns out to be beneficial and everyone is happy.
Spacedal11

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« Reply #71 on: 09-22-2011 07:13 »

Tomato, tamato. I liked Egg Man.
JoshTheater

Space Pope
****
« Reply #72 on: 09-22-2011 07:15 »
« Last Edit on: 09-22-2011 07:21 »

And that's totally fine, if you enjoyed it, you enjoyed it. I'm just defending the validity of my complaint, since apparently it bugged you.
UnrealLegend

Space Pope
****
« Reply #73 on: 09-22-2011 07:30 »

The Silence Of The Clamps

This is definitely up there for most overrated of the season. There wasn't close to enough funny to make up for the horribly lazy story. I also just couldn't accept that the crew didn't recognize who Clamps was, even though they've definitely seem him before...including at the beginning of the episode! Seriously...what was with that?
I know what's up with it. No-one other than Fry (and Bender obviously) has ever seen Clamps, and Fry only saw him for a few seconds, so he could have easily forgotten. And the crew didn't see him at the beginning of the episode, they only interacted with Joey.

And just to clear it up, I also think that this ep is also overrated CGEF-wise. smile
JoshTheater

Space Pope
****
« Reply #74 on: 09-22-2011 07:32 »
« Last Edit on: 09-22-2011 08:02 »

I know what's up with it. No-one other than Fry (and Bender obviously) has ever seen Clamps, and Fry only saw him for a few seconds, so he could have easily forgotten. And the crew didn't see him at the beginning of the episode, they only interacted with Joey.

They heard his voice. They heard him referred to as Clamps. They saw the clamps that were being delivered to him. Furthermore, just because he was offscreen during the scene where the crew delivered the clamps to Joey doesn't mean that the crew couldn't see him...Joey appeared to look right over to where Clamps was, so why couldn't the crew just have looked over and seen him through the gate?
There's no reason they shouldn't have recognized him, or at least shown some sort of suspicion, in my opinion. It was just too big of a stretch to justify a lazy plot that wasn't worth it.
spira

Liquid Emperor
**
« Reply #75 on: 09-22-2011 14:07 »

I also didn't like Silence of the Clamps much and found them not recognizing Clamps dumb. A bit of lazy writing there that can't be excused because it was funny. Because it wasn't.

I can see why Egg Man's similarity to that Simpsons ep makes it less worthy in the eyes of many, but I am really not that perturbed. Like Spacedal says, the Simpsons has done a lot. I mean, I know DXC wrote both. But if the idea worked well in both shows, which it did, then why not? It doesn't feel cheap to me or anything.
DotheBartman

Liquid Emperor
**
« Reply #76 on: 09-22-2011 18:22 »

Bart the Mother was already simply using a sitcom plot standard; in fact, it took direct inspiration from an Andy Griffith Show episode in which Opie killed a bird. Egg Man did more than enough different from other TV episodes of it's type to distinguish itself.
winna

Avatar Czar
DOOP Ubersecretary
**
« Reply #77 on: 09-22-2011 19:00 »

[insert episodes which aired in this box]
JoshTheater

Space Pope
****
« Reply #78 on: 09-22-2011 20:15 »
« Last Edit on: 09-22-2011 20:31 »

Bart the Mother was already simply using a sitcom plot standard; in fact, it took direct inspiration from an Andy Griffith Show episode in which Opie killed a bird. Egg Man did more than enough different from other TV episodes of it's type to distinguish itself.

The basic premise being recycled is not the problem here. Shows and movies use premises and flesh them out in their own way all the time, I am completely aware of this. Bart The Mother took a simple premise that wasn't original, then fleshed it out into a full story that was completely original, carried emotional weight, and was wonderfully humorous. That's not what Fry Am The Egg Man did. It didn't just take the premise from Bart The Mother, it took damn near every single plot turn in the episode and had the characters (mainly Fry) behave in the same way. They reused every single good and interesting part of the story from Bart The Mother.

Let me put it this way. They didn't just take an idea and rework it, they took an entire script and reworked it. Why shouldn't that be considered cheap?

I think I'll issue a challenge to those who have seen Fry Am The Egg Man but not Bart The Mother (or haven't seen Bart The Mother in a long time). Go watch Bart The Mother, but pretend that it's a new Simpsons episode that's just airing, and that Fry Am The Egg Man was written before it. Keep in mind that, hypothetically, DXC wrote Bart The Mother after having worked on Fry Am The Egg Man. Then come back and tell me that in that hypothetical situation, DXC didn't recycle more than just the premise of Fry Am The Egg Man. Tell me that you were still able to enjoy Bart The Mother as an episode even when you were already familiar with Fry Am The Egg Man.

It's too bad that you probably won't be able to enjoy it either, because Bart The Mother is a fantastic episode. It's far better than Fry Am The Egg Man could hope to be. If Fry Am The Egg Man had actually taken the story from Bart The Mother and done something unique and interesting with it to make it their own, I certainly wouldn't be complaining about it.
DotheBartman

Liquid Emperor
**
« Reply #79 on: 09-23-2011 03:43 »
« Last Edit on: 09-23-2011 03:45 »

Bart the Mother was already simply using a sitcom plot standard; in fact, it took direct inspiration from an Andy Griffith Show episode in which Opie killed a bird. Egg Man did more than enough different from other TV episodes of it's type to distinguish itself.

The basic premise being recycled is not the problem here. Shows and movies use premises and flesh them out in their own way all the time, I am completely aware of this. Bart The Mother took a simple premise that wasn't original, then fleshed it out into a full story that was completely original, carried emotional weight, and was wonderfully humorous. That's not what Fry Am The Egg Man did. It didn't just take the premise from Bart The Mother, it took damn near every single plot turn in the episode and had the characters (mainly Fry) behave in the same way. They reused every single good and interesting part of the story from Bart The Mother.

Let me put it this way. They didn't just take an idea and rework it, they took an entire script and reworked it. Why shouldn't that be considered cheap?

I think I'll issue a challenge to those who have seen Fry Am The Egg Man but not Bart The Mother (or haven't seen Bart The Mother in a long time). Go watch Bart The Mother, but pretend that it's a new Simpsons episode that's just airing, and that Fry Am The Egg Man was written before it. Keep in mind that, hypothetically, DXC wrote Bart The Mother after having worked on Fry Am The Egg Man. Then come back and tell me that in that hypothetical situation, DXC didn't recycle more than just the premise of Fry Am The Egg Man. Tell me that you were still able to enjoy Bart The Mother as an episode even when you were already familiar with Fry Am The Egg Man.

It's too bad that you probably won't be able to enjoy it either, because Bart The Mother is a fantastic episode. It's far better than Fry Am The Egg Man could hope to be. If Fry Am The Egg Man had actually taken the story from Bart The Mother and done something unique and interesting with it to make it their own, I certainly wouldn't be complaining about it.

Bart the Mother is certainly a fine enough episode (certainly really good for season 10, which was mostly horrible otherwise) but you're giving it a bit too much credit. The general plotline is almost exactly the same as "Opie the Birdman" and various other TV episodes. Bear in mind both of them were based around the guilt of the main character, which Eggman was not; it uses a somewhat similar premise, but the actual conflict is entirely different. Fry has to decide whether he cares more about his friends (especially Leela) or a pet that is genuinely dangerous; Bart is simply trying to save his lizards out of guilt for the bird he assumed was their mother (wow, the more I think about it, the lazier and more non-sensical that plot point seems now), and those who seek to destroy them are essentially antagonists in the story. Eggman adds a mystery element and various sci-fi elements. The emotional crux is completely different. The general journey and arc and even story structure of it is not the same; it borrows more loosely from the standard sitcom plot than The Simpsons episode did.

You'll find a lot of Futurama (and Simpsons) episodes are already based pretty heavily in pre-existing plots or tropes, often purposely so. Even the best episodes often take very direct inspiration from other things and in some cases border on outright stealing. Is "Bender Gets Made," for instance, really much different than a lot of mob stories we've all seen before? Not really. It's just more interesting because it involves robots.

I thought Eggman was a "good, not amazing" episode. I thought of the Simpsons comparison even before I saw it, but it was more different than I thought I would be, and not really any more similar to Bart the Mother than Bart the Mother was to a lot of previous shows. Parts of it were a bit cliche, but it did a lot of interesting new things too, and the cliches were more general ones than anything from its sister show in particular. But then, my point of reference for standard plot-lines goes beyond those two shows.
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