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Author Topic: What is your favorite Futurama movie?  (Read 31140 times)
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PEE Poll: what is you favourite movie?
beast with a billion backs   -27 (11.3%)
benders game   -36 (15%)
benders big score   -81 (33.8%)
into the wild green yonder   -96 (40%)
Total Voters: 240

Javier Lopez

Urban Legend
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« Reply #40 on: 02-28-2009 15:44 »
« Last Edit on: 02-28-2009 19:08 »


Not really. It tied back to it, made it make sense.

Of course, it destroyed the illusion that Seymour waited for Fry for a thousand years... which means you won't cry at the ending anymore, but that's surely an acceptable casualty given that it's still a very moving sequence?

Jurasic Bark was a moving episode and the moving factor was what defined it.. now stating out that seymour never really waited for Fry simply denies the ep the sense of it.. now we see simply a dog in a walkway wich we know wasnt waiting for Fry that long..only for hours each day..



About the topic.. i have not seen the last one yet so i cant decide.. for the first three.. i would say Bender's Game.. for a slight margin ..it had touches that made me laught and it had an "epic" history wich ended and had an impact to say..  its not a normal ep where at the end everything returns to normal
suss6052

Starship Captain
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« Reply #41 on: 02-28-2009 15:50 »

You really couldn't have thought Seymour had been lying down waiting to die and then all of a sudden been standing up completely at attention the moment before being fast fossilized as in how his remains were found in the wreckage of the old pizza parlor in the year 3000 or so, therefore I don't see how explaining how it really happened ruins the previous moment. Then again I never did find it to be quite as touching as having his nephew named after him, or the ending to The Devils Hands are Idol Playthings.
Frisco17

DOOP Secretary
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« Reply #42 on: 02-28-2009 16:18 »

1.ITWGY/BBS
2.BG
3.BWABB
Bubble Gum

Bending Unit
***
« Reply #43 on: 02-28-2009 17:31 »

I watched the 1st three in order before I watched ITWGY, then I watched ITWGY a couple more times to catch some of the little things I missed the 1st time around.

My order with explaination;

1. BBS: the first was the best. The whole movie played as such, with no ep story arc skips. LOL thewhole way through.
2. ITWGY: also LOL all the way through, especially the 1st 22 minutes. Still like BBS better. I could have made them 1a and 1b.
3. BWBB: had some lol moments, especially some of the Zapp and Farnsworth/Wernstrem interaction, but I didnt like how the BBS story line was almost completely forgotten by the beginning of this one.
4. BG: some of the jokes were good, and the story had prommise, but it just wasn't that funny. The ending seemed thrown together too.
Waze

Poppler
*
« Reply #44 on: 02-28-2009 18:59 »

Cant decide which one is better, ITWGY or BBS.
Both of the movies are really good.
So ill have to say i like ITWGY and BBS the most
and them comes BWBB and BG
Gorky

Space Pope
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« Reply #45 on: 03-02-2009 03:41 »

Definitely "Into the Wild Green Yonder"--I felt it was the funniest, most emotionally-satisfying movie of the bunch. I thought it handled the Fry/Leela ship well--better than BBS, actually, because it was nice to see the affection reciprocated; the "I love you"s felt a bit tacked-on, sure, but it was still a great moment, ten years in the making.

As for the other movies: "Bender's Big Score" was romantic and sweet and happiness-inducing, but I think my love of it is driven partly by the fact that it was the first new Futurama I'd seen in over four years. And I disliked "The Beast With a Billion Backs" when I first saw it, because it completely disregarded the whole Lars thing (one of my nitpicks about the last three movies, in general, is that they completely ignored Lars' existence, and the impact that had on Leela's feelings for Fry), and that pissed me off; but I just re-watched it yesterday, and it's pretty hilarious, in a frustrating way. In contrast, I really enjoyed "Bender's Game" the first time I saw it; watching it today, though, I was consistently bored through the last forty-five minutes, which is never a good thing.

So, in convenient list form:

1. Into the Wild Green Yonder
2. Bender's Big Score (followed very closely by)
3. The Beast With a Billion Backs
4. Bender's Game
x.Bianca.x

Urban Legend
***
« Reply #46 on: 03-02-2009 08:51 »

Ok, my order:

1. ITWGY
2. BG
3. BBS
4. BWABB

Although bbs and bwabb are around the same, I liked them both.
lilkitten29

Starship Captain
****
« Reply #47 on: 03-03-2009 00:54 »

I dunno. I really liked BBS and ITWGY...but maybe I liked ITWGY a little bit more.

My order:

1. ITWGY
2.BBS
3.BWABB
4.BG

BWABB was okay..I thought the first half was pretty good, but then it just started to get weird during the last half. I really liked the first hour of BG but I'm sorry to say this, that last half hour just ruined it for me. I hated that whole fantasy thing. I'm more of a sci-fi fan than a fantasy fan.
mohawkdan

Crustacean
*
« Reply #48 on: 03-03-2009 02:29 »

1 BBS
2 ITWGY
3 BG
4 BWABB

i think most of all BBS had the best story and pulled at the emotional heartstrings the most.  it didnt have any throw away acts and the movie flowed extremely well.  it had some great humor and more than its share of sci-fi along with a great battle sequence towards the end.  it also was the first inclusion of the futurama theme remix (as far as the series goes, it was previously found on the futurama game).

the remaining movies were all pretty good, but i found them lacking in different ways.  for example the first act of ITWGY is almost a complete throw away.  the only thing that takes place that is relevant to the rest of the movie is fry's ability to read peoples thoughts and leela finding the "dark one".  the rest of the act was funny, but didnt add anything more than humor. 

benders game almost felt like 2 movies due to the fantasy flip.  while not a bad thing, im not a lotr fan so the fantasy portion didnt really "knock it up a notch" for me.  it was still done well and i found myself laughing harder than i expected.

i definitely like BWABB least of all.  a month has passed since the touching ending of BBS and leela and fry are as far a part as ever.  after what appears to be a short relationship he is so distraught that he wants to leave the know universe?  i know fry isnt the sharpest knife in the drawer,  but he takes it harder than his previous personality would imply.  i understand it was reason to get him tenticaled, but they could have came up with a more characterful way.  amy sleeping with zapp, whats that all about.  it does nothing for the story but make amy look like a slut.  i understand zapp took advantage of the situation as he would, but still give amy some credibility.  bender is just all over the place, first being calculon's stalker to member of the LoR, to overtly jealous of fry, to having a son, to waging a war ala' pirates of the caribbean on "heaven".  it just turned out to be mash up of plot ideas when they should have picked a couple and made a better film.  even still, i will say that as its futurama it is still better than most other things out there.
Polski515

Poppler
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« Reply #49 on: 03-03-2009 09:13 »

mine has to be BBS.  the story of fry and leela in the future overlapping woth fry and leeloo in the past was realy well done. it took me back to my favorite episode jurassic bark.  very well written and set the bar for the other three.
my list:
1) BBS
2) BG
3) BWABB
4) ITWGY
Marzipan

Crustacean
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« Reply #50 on: 03-05-2009 05:29 »

Bender's Big Score, no question!
BiteMyShinyMetalHat

Poppler
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« Reply #51 on: 03-05-2009 17:59 »

ITWGY is the best movie although i loved all 4 of them.
Books

Near Death Star Inhabitant
Urban Legend
***
« Reply #52 on: 03-05-2009 18:10 »

Haven't seen the 4th, but Beast With a Billion Backs is leading. Bender's Game was just awful. I didn't like it at all frown
Cinimod

Bending Unit
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« Reply #53 on: 03-06-2009 12:28 »

into the wild green yonder is great, bender's game is second followed by BBS and BWABB. In my opinion BWABB was rubbish, and Fry + Leela were really out of character
mohawkdan

Crustacean
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« Reply #54 on: 03-07-2009 02:28 »

BWABB was rubbish, and Fry + Leela were really out of character

while i wouldnt call it rubbish, i completely agree about them being out of character.
SonicPanther

Professor
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« Reply #55 on: 03-07-2009 09:04 »
« Last Edit on: 03-07-2009 09:06 »

1. BBS
2. ITWGY
3/4. BG and BWABB
It was a close call between BBS and ITGWY for me, but I ultimately decided that BBS had the edge because it's so rewatchable - I've seen it around 20 times, no joke. They both had excellent plots, the classic Futurama brand of humor, and great characterization. The other two... Not so much. I just didn't find BWABB too funny, and I found Fry and Leela to be annoyingly out of character. BG had a very weak plot that had potential but ended up all over the place. I understand the Rule of Funny and that jokes are the main priority, but I can't enjoy something if I don't find the story interesting. This probably sounds bizarre, but it would have been better without the D&D angle, which I found very tacked on. It's definitely funnier than BWABB, though.

Look at all those acronyms! I also found that I say "I found" a lot.
MatMan

Delivery Boy
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« Reply #56 on: 03-07-2009 10:51 »
« Last Edit on: 03-07-2009 10:53 »

My favourite is definately ITWGY easily, then BBS, BG, BWABB (though the first three movies I like fairly equally).

Leo Wong killed it in ITWGY - "Oh yeah? Well I Leo Wong and I say BOOM!"

Not to mention "I'm Bender - let's do it!"
Calculord

Crustacean
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« Reply #57 on: 03-08-2009 01:10 »

As much as I loved ITWGY, it just wasnt as funny as the others. It was the perfect Futurama movie in all departments other than humor. I loved it's story! BG was great, I loved every second. BWABB I really didnt like. BBS was AMAZING the whole time-travel thing stunned me with its dept.
1. BG
2. BBS and ITWGY (neither is better then the other)
3. BWABB
songficcer

Bending Unit
***
« Reply #58 on: 03-14-2009 08:36 »

I'd have to say Bender's Big Score followed closely by The Beast With a Billion Backs.

Of course, I haven't seen the latest one yet, so my opinion is subject to change.  big grin
speedracer
Bending Unit
***
« Reply #59 on: 03-15-2009 17:25 »
« Last Edit on: 03-15-2009 20:04 »

BBS 9/10
ITWGY 7/10
BWABB 5.5/10
BG 5/10

Bender's Big Score -- funny, amazingly complex and yet (sort of) sensible plot, lots of relevant callbacks to the original series, and deeply emotional.  If you don't feel bad for 45-year-old Fry in 2012 after he's lost Leelu and Leela, you have no soul.  The only real criticism I have is that before the climactic scenes, original Fry is more whiny and mopey than he needs to be (in the original script that Ken Keeler wrote, he does and says some really mean-spirited things as well).

Into The Wild Green Yonder -- Epic adventure that fills out the characters very well.  We get to see more of Amy's struggles with her parents, and it's nice to finally see Fry and Leela treating each other right.  The humor is kind of a mixed bag, unfortunately -- the Vegas chapter and the Mad Fellows are funny, but the eco-feminists get annoying pretty quickly, as do all the gender-typing jokes.  The scientific details (names of astronomical objects, etc.) are a plus.

Beast With A Billion Backs -- If it weren't for the fact that it had to trample all over the Fry-Leela subplot, it'd have been a pretty good movie.  On a macro scale, it's an amusing parody of monster movies, romantic comedies and religious notions of God and heaven.  (Bender's mock-up of 1 Corinthians 13 at the end is especially hilarious.)

Bender's Game -- I understand that the writers wanted to do some sort of D&D/LOTR parody, but I don't understand why they only did 30 minutes of it and tacked it on in such an unnatural, unconvincing way.  The jokes are funny, but the movie as a whole is completely disjointed.
dr.bender nye

Liquid Emperor
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« Reply #60 on: 03-15-2009 20:17 »

To me, Into the Wild Green Yonder really got to the roots of the original series. Anyone else agree with that?
Curious Gorge

Bending Unit
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« Reply #61 on: 03-15-2009 20:25 »

To me, Into the Wild Green Yonder really got to the roots of the original series. Anyone else agree with that?

100% agree.
mossy

Bending Unit
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« Reply #62 on: 03-15-2009 21:12 »

To me, Into the Wild Green Yonder really got to the roots of the original series. Anyone else agree with that?

100% agree.

me too. if it went straight from BBS to ITWGY it would be better. BWABB and BG just felt unrelated(other than yivo) :/
Curious Gorge

Bending Unit
***
« Reply #63 on: 03-16-2009 00:50 »

BWABB was just so out of place. There were a number of key players who just seemed completely out of character. I know Fry's impulsive and you can just about justify him getting with Colleen - he thought the world was ending after all. But he essentially just ignores Leela all movie until the very end, after the events of BBS it was so jarring.

Then there was Leela who went from being jealous to supportive without so much as a moments notice. The characterisation was very odd for the most part.

That said I could easily forgive dubious characterisation if the movie was good on the whole but sadly it was average at best.

At least BG was good for the most part with ITWGY being a resounding return to form.
Books

Near Death Star Inhabitant
Urban Legend
***
« Reply #64 on: 03-16-2009 01:00 »

BBS - 6.5
BWABB - 8
BG - 3
ITWGY - not seen
GalacticEntity

Crustacean
*
« Reply #65 on: 03-18-2009 08:03 »

Two things I don't understand about the general consensus of the movies: (1) The love of Bender's Big Score and (2) the criticism of The Beast With a Billion Backs.

1) First and foremost, I do not find BBS funny.  It has its moments, sure, but man those are few and far in between. 
    Second, how can you change the most emotionally moving moments from the series into nothing more than an alternate reality?  Jurassic Bark and The Luck of the Fryrish were far more moving than any Fry-Leela story, and now they were traded for a boring time-travel plot that leads up to a romantic climax that's not even better than the finale episode (or The Sting and The Why of Fry, imo).

2) I think the most common critique of BWABB is the discontinuation of Fry and Leela's relationship, and that's the one I find most weird.  I mean, the series only has like 7 episodes dedicated to that, and even fewer acknowledging it.  In between those are the numerous and hilarious stories that BWABB most identifies with.  I understand this was a direct continuation of BSS, but their relationship was never the series' main focus and they've always tastefully limited the amount of time they give to it.  I think people's expectation of it being there, and their eventual disappointment, is unfairly impacting how they view the film.
    I also think the rape claims made over at the Futurama Madhouse were a bit ridiculous.  Futurama is filled with dark humor, and Yivo's actions should be judged in context, not your dissecting interpretations.  But on the other hand, I can understand some of the "out of character" points, and personally dislike 3 jokes that remind me too much of Family Guy (the ant's *talking*, the Superman guy, King Kong).
Gorky

Space Pope
****
« Reply #66 on: 03-18-2009 11:47 »
« Last Edit on: 03-18-2009 11:49 »

Hey, GalacticEntity--welcome to PEEL. You bring up some great points, but I've got a few counterpoints.

1) First and foremost, I do not find BBS funny.  It has its moments, sure, but man those are few and far in between.

I actually do agree with this. BBS definitely isn't the funniest movie (to me, that distinction goes to either TBWaBB or ItWGY); but, to be fair, I don't think the love of BBS is fueled by the belief that it's a hilarious piece of cinema. I think people generally like it best for one of two reasons: 1.) it was the first new Futurama we got in over four years, so there's some risidual gidiness coloring the perception of the film itself; or 2.) they appreciate the emotional arc (which, IMO, is heavy-handed but very touching) more than the humor. 
   
Quote
Second, how can you change the most emotionally moving moments from the series into nothing more than an alternate reality?  Jurassic Bark and The Luck of the Fryrish were far more moving than any Fry-Leela story, and now they were traded for a boring time-travel plot that leads up to a romantic climax that's not even better than the finale episode (or The Sting and The Why of Fry, imo).

I mentioned this in another thread over on the Weird Scenes board, but I don't think BBS ruins the ending of "Jurassic Bark". If anything, I think it provides it with some internal logic (regarding Seymour's fast-fossilization). "The Luck of the Fryrish" does lose some of its emotional punch (which is a bummer, because I always preferred it to JB anyway), but I don't think that's reason enough to cast BBS aside. And your belief that JB and TLotF are both more moving than the shippy episodes is an opinion; personally, I think "Time Keeps on Slipping" and "The Sting" are just as engaging as those two episodes. But I do agree that the ending of BBS, though sweet and revelatory and all that good stuff, is nowhere near as emotionally resonant.

Quote
2) I think the most common critique of BWABB is the discontinuation of Fry and Leela's relationship, and that's the one I find most weird.  I mean, the series only has like 7 episodes dedicated to that, and even fewer acknowledging it.  In between those are the numerous and hilarious stories that BWABB most identifies with.  I understand this was a direct continuation of BSS, but their relationship was never the series' main focus and they've always tastefully limited the amount of time they give to it.  I think people's expectation of it being there, and their eventual disappointment, is unfairly impacting how they view the film.

But I think that's a fair critique, especially considering the ending of BBS. Moreso than "The Sting", or even "The Devil's Hands are Idle Playthings", BBS presented conclusive proof that Leela's feelings for Fry (or Fry-by-proxy) are deep. She refers to Lars as "the only man she'll ever love", which is a pretty powerful statement when you fast-forward and realize that Lars is Fry. That kiss at the funeral doesn't cut it for me, emotionally; at the very least TBWaBB should've found a way to incorporate the Lars thing, even briefly (for example, it strikes me as really strange that he isn't mentioned once when Leela is comforting the recently widowed Amy), while still satisfying the humor of the story. Because, for the record, I actually enjoy TBWaBB, if I look at it like a season two--or even season three--episode; the ship had no place in the story, but I think that's a failure on the writers' part. To me, it would've made a lot more sense if BBS directly preceded ItWGY; BG and TBWaBB should've come before both of 'em. (From a marketing standpoint, though, I think it was wise to release BBS first; the writers know that a lot of fans love the more emotional side to the show, and BBS embodies that. But still.)
speedracer
Bending Unit
***
« Reply #67 on: 03-18-2009 11:50 »
« Last Edit on: 03-18-2009 12:23 »

Two things I don't understand about the general consensus of the movies: (1) The love of Bender's Big Score and (2) the criticism of The Beast With a Billion Backs.

1) First and foremost, I do not find BBS funny.  It has its moments, sure, but man those are few and far in between. 
    Second, how can you change the most emotionally moving moments from the series into nothing more than an alternate reality?  Jurassic Bark and The Luck of the Fryrish were far more moving than any Fry-Leela story, and now they were traded for a boring time-travel plot that leads up to a romantic climax that's not even better than the finale episode (or The Sting and The Why of Fry, imo).

2) I think the most common critique of BWABB is the discontinuation of Fry and Leela's relationship, and that's the one I find most weird.  I mean, the series only has like 7 episodes dedicated to that, and even fewer acknowledging it.  In between those are the numerous and hilarious stories that BWABB most identifies with.  I understand this was a direct continuation of BSS, but their relationship was never the series' main focus and they've always tastefully limited the amount of time they give to it.  I think people's expectation of it being there, and their eventual disappointment, is unfairly impacting how they view the film.
    I also think the rape claims made over at the Futurama Madhouse were a bit ridiculous.  Futurama is filled with dark humor, and Yivo's actions should be judged in context, not your dissecting interpretations.  But on the other hand, I can understand some of the "out of character" points, and personally dislike 3 jokes that remind me too much of Family Guy (the ant's *talking*, the Superman guy, King Kong).

1)  I certainly understand why some would be upset that the events of "Luck of the Fryrish" and "Jurassic Bark" were overwritten (it doesn't really bother me that much, though I like both episodes).

2) It's one thing to ignore Fry and Leela's relationship; BG makes no reference to it and I don't think anyone really misses it.  However, BWABB does more than "discontinue" Fry and Leela's relationship; it sets it back somewhere around season 2.  The characters in Futurama are compelling because they feel like real people, and it's a stretch to imagine that Fry and Leela would act the way they do in BWABB following the events of the original series and BBS.
Phil K

Crustacean
*
« Reply #68 on: 03-18-2009 16:05 »

Benders Big Score first, then Bender's Game 2nd - then Billion Backs and Green Yonder 9th and 10th.
Yep, the last two were very poor compared to 1 and 3
FistfulOAwesome

Starship Captain
****
« Reply #69 on: 03-18-2009 18:11 »
« Last Edit on: 05-17-2009 20:31 »

As far as I'm concerned the series canon is as so: S1 through S4- ITWGY- (The Real) Season 5?

BBS is the first sign that we got that these were mostly going to be bad. While there are great moments like the Death Star Battle, Holiday Rap, and the Nudists (I liked them) there is too much given up to make this movie work.

Leela completely ignores Fry's feelings throughout the movie. I can understand that she is excited about her new relationship but considering she knows about Fry's feelings for her she didn't have to rub his nose into it. She could have let him down easy.

We lose Bender early on. His control under the nudists essentially neuter his performance. Worst thing about that is the movie is still focused on Bender yet Bender isn't himself. That's a waste of probably the best character on the show.

Nibblers bit in the movie is unnecessary. He doesn't add anything to the movie. Seriously, take him out and nothing is lost. About the only reason for him to be in it is to explain that the time code is paradox correcting (which I think is stupid) and one-way and that could have been explained by a legend (maybe as part of that fairy-tale book from 409).

Lars didn't work out as planned. He was supposed to ingrain to the audience that Leela is truly in love with Fry but that is messed with by the fact that Leela barely acknowledges Fry throughout the movie. We're supposed to believe that she loves this guy who she barely knows exist? And seriously, it's been 3 years since Devils Hands. They should be great friends (better than they were by S4) yet they have drifted so far apart.

Whoops! Sorry! I was supposed to be writing about Lars. Anyway, there isn't enough of Fry in Lars to make his purpose believable. Aside from that nice moment at Elzar's he doesn't act like Fry at all. I don't care how mature how Fry would get there is no way he'd become "a bald-headed coook (is that how it's spelled?)".

What about the whole Big Score part of the title. I thought the entire episode would be a romp through time with Bender as he steals all these great treasures yet it only is made a focus through the second chapter and we only see Bender steal two things (Pharaoh Mask and East Coast/West Coast Rap Treaty). I thought guys as talented as the Futurama writers could make a big Time Travel story work.

Speaking of that, did anybody complain about how big a waste of a Time Travel story this movie is? So you have Futurama, an incredibly well written satire of Sci-Fi while at the same time great Sci-Fi show in its own right, do a movie based around time travel and only 1 period (early 2000's) is extensively visited. What a waste! BBS should have been massive in its scope. We should have been able to see the PE crew visit Rome at its height, The Jurassic Period, and other great times but its wasted on a less than great love story.

BWABB. I already wrote extensively about it's jumps in logic and ignoring of character and plot development extensively (http://www.peelified.com/index.php?topic=17266.msg1021948#msg1021948) so I'll go through some of my other issues.

First of all, why is it that the title character of the movie doesn't show up till the halfway point? Hell, if you want to get technical we don't really meet the creature (I refuse to call him (it acts like a dude, it's a him) by his name because that might make me remember the movie) until the end of the 3rd chapter so he is really only present for about 22 minutes. Movies do not work that way! You use the first 20 minutes or so introducing your characters or premise and then you get to the point.

Looking back I don't think I like Colleen as much as I thought I did. She's wonderfully acted by Brittany Murphy but she really doesn't have much of a purpose in the movie. Yeah, she's the reason Fry goes through the rift but she is quickly forgotten at various times (read more on my Beast inconsistencies post) so her purpose is diffused.

On the Rip: A hole is blasted to a parallel universe. This place could be used for anything. Alternate versions of people and places in our universe could be used or alternatively it could be a completely different universe filled with an infinite amount of possibility for new sights and characters and it's wasted on a hentai joke. A bad one! I know how funny a person found the creature is in the realm of personal opinion. Good thing I'm writing this in my post then.

By the way, if the Rip was going to be used for a parallel universe it probably would have been better used for Benders Game.

I gotta say, the Creature is a complete waste of time for me. Not only did I not find it funny (only line from it I laughed at was that phone message it left (and that had more to do with imaging David Cross actually leaving that message to a girlfriend in real life), it didn't really do anything. I mean it burst through Earth's defenses (I thought that the Diamondium shield (or was it Diamondillium?) looked really cool and if the movie was good could have been an iconic image. Too bad they waste it by having the Creature tear through it), "made love" to every creature on the planet, and eventually carries all of them to live inside it and yet it still doesn't remain memorable to me.

I love David Cross but he was probably the wrong person for this role. I thought he was good for it since his comedy was always "out there" and this creature certainly qualifies as "out there" but looking back on it he's too aloof in the role. He doesn't even try to hide his voice or general personality. The Creature has no self. It is David Cross. I feel bad for saying this but his performance most reminds me of Pauly Shore's. It reeks of "I'm just here doing my job" rather that him having any real enjoyment from doing it (although, maybe he just read the script and was immediately saddened on what he would have to portray (cheap shot FTW!).

Bender's Game had promise but squandered it on tired LOTR jokes (I never played DND but I know enough that the credit to Gary Gygax at the end is a little insulting considering how little the movie played like a DND Game). It would have been better to focus the entire movie on either the Dark Matter storyline or the Fantasy storyline. Together neither of them gets the time they deserve.

Leela is so OOC it isn't even funny (literally. BOOSH!). She wasn't very in character in the first two either but she seems even more controlled by the writing in this one. While Leela's anger was always part of the fabric of the show it wasn't her sole character trait. Her training in Arcturan Kung-Fu probably helped her control her anger (despite what is shown of her in 208 the amount of time spent practicing her art would have helped her with her anger issues). Here it is played for weak laughs and becomes her defining characteristic. What is it with these first three movies and delegating the characters to 2-dimensional versions of themselves (http://www.instantrimshot.com/)?

Could the writers have come up with a more weak-sauce way to bring the characters into the fantasy world? I'm not sure what they were thinking.

Bender in the HAL Institute didn't do much for me. It's probably not as funny because Fry isn't there.

What is with the Fantasy world anyway? The professor has an explanation by the end but it doesn't make sense. Except for Fry and Leela nobody remembers who they are. Why? It is destroyed as soon as Momon picks up the Die. Did that universe actually exists. Does this mean that Mom destroyed a universe? I don't really feel like examining it too closely but I'm sure it's generally understood that the writers didn't do much with this world.

I had a problem with the ending as soon as I saw it. So Momon picks up the Die, destroys the fantasy world, and the situation is reset to normal? So what was the point of the fantasy world? The only reason the fantasy world mattered was so Igner could tell Farnsworth that he is his father which he could have done in the Nibblonian chamber. What a waste of my and everybody's time!

Side Note: I actually think the second chapter of BG plus the ending would have made a pretty good episode and I think Fry is actually spot on in the first chapter.

ITWGY is absolutely fantastic. I wrote a review on it on its page: http://www.peelified.com/index.php?topic=17079.msg1019416#msg1019416

Suffice it to say that it is the only one I consider a true Futurama episode. I hope as much as anybody that it isn't the last we see of the PE Crew (in animated form). The writers seem to have finally gotten their talent back (or alternatively killed the Skulls of themselves who wrote the first three). Hopefully FOX renews the show quickly lest the writers become rusty again.
FistfulOAwesome

Starship Captain
****
« Reply #70 on: 03-18-2009 18:13 »

Hey, I'm a Crustacean! No, wait. I'm still a Human. Also good!
GalacticEntity

Crustacean
*
« Reply #71 on: 03-18-2009 18:30 »
« Last Edit on: 03-18-2009 18:54 »

Hey, GalacticEntity--welcome to PEEL. You bring up some great points, but I've got a few counterpoints.

I actually do agree with this. BBS definitely isn't the funniest movie (to me, that distinction goes to either TBWaBB or ItWGY); but, to be fair, I don't think the love of BBS is fueled by the belief that it's a hilarious piece of cinema. I think people generally like it best for one of two reasons: 1.) it was the first new Futurama we got in over four years, so there's some risidual gidiness coloring the perception of the film itself; or 2.) they appreciate the emotional arc (which, IMO, is heavy-handed but very touching) more than the humor.

    You're right, its not usually claimed to be the most funny, and this is pretty subjective anyway.  But I was excited for the return of Futurama as well, and while I enjoyed BBS, I think the sum of its lacking parts are just that: lacking.  Man, that sounds more harsh than I mean, because I don't think it's horrible or anything, just a little.. underwhelming.  As for the story, I think I can enjoy a good romantic tale, but too much was sacrificed for just an average one.

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I mentioned this in another thread over on the Weird Scenes board, but I don't think BBS ruins the ending of "Jurassic Bark". If anything, I think it provides it with some internal logic (regarding Seymour's fast-fossilization). "The Luck of the Fryrish" does lose some of its emotional punch (which is a bummer, because I always preferred it to JB anyway), but I don't think that's reason enough to cast BBS aside. And your belief that JB and TLotF are both more moving than the shippy episodes is an opinion; personally, I think "Time Keeps on Slipping" and "The Sting" are just as engaging as those two episodes. But I do agree that the ending of BBS, though sweet and revelatory and all that good stuff, is nowhere near as emotionally resonant.

   This one I do maintain.  Unfortunately, it's hard to argue all the thing they could've done, so I'm not sure how some of this will hold up.
    I think Seymour's fossilization is far too small a detail to sacrifice for the great ending of "Jurassic Bark" and it could have been done way better imo.  This may vary person to person, but the most moving thing in JB is Seymour's waiting, not the tragedy of Fry thinking he had a full life after he left.  So with that in mind, it's a little off-putting that Fry would dedicate most of his time to Leelu and then abandon Seymour all together when he goes on the ship.  This hurts the sweet and loving friendship that JB sets up, and weakens the blow when Seymour's unbreakable dedication turns out to be a one-way feeling.  Hmm.. I guess that DOES make it more sad, but at the cost of Fry looking cold.
    A better way to fossilize him and keeping with the story was that duplicate Fry hadn't been in New York that whole time (anywhere else, really), and instead had only returned to Seymour, coincidentally, at his last minutes of life.  He stands to greet Fry, then Bender, still tracking him, fires and so on.
    That or something along those lines would also "save" TLotF.  To sum up this point, this was a bad trade.  But again, while this certainly hurts my opinion of the movie, I still enjoy it, as I do for nearly every Futurama episode or movie.

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But I think that's a fair critique, especially considering the ending of BBS. Moreso than "The Sting", or even "The Devil's Hands are Idle Playthings", BBS presented conclusive proof that Leela's feelings for Fry (or Fry-by-proxy) are deep. She refers to Lars as "the only man she'll ever love", which is a pretty powerful statement when you fast-forward and realize that Lars is Fry. That kiss at the funeral doesn't cut it for me, emotionally; at the very least TBWaBB should've found a way to incorporate the Lars thing, even briefly (for example, it strikes me as really strange that he isn't mentioned once when Leela is comforting the recently widowed Amy), while still satisfying the humor of the story. Because, for the record, I actually enjoy TBWaBB, if I look at it like a season two--or even season three--episode; the ship had no place in the story, but I think that's a failure on the writers' part. To me, it would've made a lot more sense if BBS directly preceded ItWGY; BG and TBWaBB should've come before both of 'em. (From a marketing standpoint, though, I think it was wise to release BBS first; the writers know that a lot of fans love the more emotional side to the show, and BBS embodies that. But still.)

2) It's one thing to ignore Fry and Leela's relationship; BG makes no reference to it and I don't think anyone really misses it.  However, BWABB does more than "discontinue" Fry and Leela's relationship; it sets it back somewhere around season 2.  The characters in Futurama are compelling because they feel like real people, and it's a stretch to imagine that Fry and Leela would act the way they do in BWABB following the events of the original series and BBS.

    OK, here's where we get to the meat of it.  First of all, as I recall, Lars isn't mentioned in any of the other movies.  Not even in IWGY, where Fry and Leela's relationship are revisited, so it seems to me that BWABB is getting the short stick just for being the first one not to mention him.  I think this further proves the somewhat flimsy continuity of the show that some see as reason enough to justify this criticism.  You can watch "The Sting" before "Time Keeps on Slippin'"  or  "The Why of Fry" before "Parasites Lost" and never know you saw it 'out-of-order'.  Plotting their relationship and seeing an actual progress can hardly be done.
    And as far as the progress of their relationship goes, we see something that we caught wind of in "Time Keeps on Slippin'".  Leela basically says that she likes Fry, but he would need to mature for her to love him.  His dedication to the holophonor in "The Devil's Hands Are Idle Play Things" was a step in the right direction.  Is it not reasonable to assume that both Fry and Leela realize that he has to mature (a la Lars) before she completely falls for him?  She also confirms that there is nothing Fry can do to make her love him, so her word about never loving another like Lars can be seen as a characteristic of Leela (that has been confirmed by other characters and the creators/actors): when it comes to relationships, Leela is a mess.  For time issues, I don't think I need to list out that proof.
    Again, the writers and such have never had even two consecutive stories about them.  Maybe it's because I knew it wouldn't be continued (read it in an interview before BWABB was released), that I am able to easily overlook this.  And I'll defend the order of the movies as well because I think it's the Futurama way.  The love story is scattered in there, surrounded by the hilarious adventures the the Planet Express crew.

PS - This may seem a bit lazy, but I do not want to find and read all the uncharacteristic things that happen in BWABB.  I would like to read what others' thoughts are on that and discuss it here.
speedracer
Bending Unit
***
« Reply #72 on: 03-18-2009 20:10 »
« Last Edit on: 03-18-2009 21:13 »

For the tl;dr crowd:  just because a graph has ups and downs doesn't mean that there isn't a general trend in some specific direction.

For everyone else:

2) It's one thing to ignore Fry and Leela's relationship; BG makes no reference to it and I don't think anyone really misses it.  However, BWABB does more than "discontinue" Fry and Leela's relationship; it sets it back somewhere around season 2.  The characters in Futurama are compelling because they feel like real people, and it's a stretch to imagine that Fry and Leela would act the way they do in BWABB following the events of the original series and BBS.

    OK, here's where we get to the meat of it.  First of all, as I recall, Lars isn't mentioned in any of the other movies.  Not even in IWGY, where Fry and Leela's relationship are revisited, so it seems to me that BWABB is getting the short stick just for being the first one not to mention him.  I think this further proves the somewhat flimsy continuity of the show that some see as reason enough to justify this criticism.  You can watch "The Sting" before "Time Keeps on Slippin'"  or  "The Why of Fry" before "Parasites Lost" and never know you saw it 'out-of-order'.  Plotting their relationship and seeing an actual progress can hardly be done.

I disagree pretty strongly with your assertion, both from actual experience (I happened to see some of the season 4 episodes, BBS and BWABB before the rest of the series) and on theoretical grounds.  "The Sting", "Love And Rocket", and several other episodes would be completely out of place in Seasons 1 and 2.  Compare Fry's casual (to say the least) view of romantic relationships in "A Flight To Remember" and "Put Your Head On My Shoulder" to his attitude towards Leela in Season 4.  The difference is striking.

I don't see much of a problem with Lars not being mentioned at all in the later three movies.  Continuity is about characters remembering and growing from their experiences, not just about the writers inserting explicit callbacks to previous episodes.

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And as far as the progress of their relationship goes, we see something that we caught wind of in "Time Keeps on Slippin'".  Leela basically says that she likes Fry, but he would need to mature for her to love him.  His dedication to the holophonor in "The Devil's Hands Are Idle Play Things" was a step in the right direction.  Is it not reasonable to assume that both Fry and Leela realize that he has to mature (a la Lars) before she completely falls for him? 

Okay, but I'm pretty sure Leela recognizes that Fry's already taken steps in that direction.  Also, the "progress" in their relationship isn't just about Fry trying to meet the standard that Leela has set; it's also about Leela gradually realizing that she isn't as bulletproof as she wishes she were, that she still carries deep emotional scars from her childhood, and that if there's someone who loves her for who she is and wants to help her heal, it's okay to let him in (cf. "Bicyclops Built For Two", "The Cyber House Rules", "Leela's Homeworld").

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She also confirms that there is nothing Fry can do to make her love him, so her word about never loving another like Lars can be seen as a characteristic of Leela (that has been confirmed by other characters and the creators/actors): when it comes to relationships, Leela is a mess.  For time issues, I don't think I need to list out that proof.

I don't follow your logic here at all.  Leela's statement in "Time Keeps On Slipping" takes place about 1-2 years before "Devil's Hands" and 6 years before BBS.  A lot changes during that time.

Given that Leela had been left at the altar four days previous, I wouldn't interpret her statement about Lars as any sort of strong evidence about Leela's character.  The main purpose of that statement, according to the DVD commentary, was to provide the audience one final clue as to Lars's true identity.  It is certainly a regression (not as jarring as BWABB, but enough to upset some fans) to have Leela falling in love with a mysterious stranger at the beginning of BBS, but the only reason Leela and Lars got as far as they did was because Lars really was Fry and thus knew what it took to make Leela happy.

Fry's behavior in BBS is even more reliant upon history than Leela's.  Without it, Fry comes off as just a little snot who's acting petulantly because he isn't getting what he wants.  With it, his frustration and heartbreak is understandable (though he certainly is whinier than I'd prefer), and his attempt to give Leela up to Lars is a real sacrifice.

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Again, the writers and such have never had even two consecutive stories about them.  Maybe it's because I knew it wouldn't be continued (read it in an interview before BWABB was released), that I am able to easily overlook this.  And I'll defend the order of the movies as well because I think it's the Futurama way.  The love story is scattered in there, surrounded by the hilarious adventures the the Planet Express crew.

Perhaps I'm misinterpreting you, so please correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems to me that for you, "progress" isn't really progress unless it's represented by a graph that is constantly moving in one direction, and I don't think that needs to be the case.  Like the stock market, Fry and Leela's relationship has had ups, downs, and periods of stasis, but I am pretty confident that there is a general upward trend (to the extent that it can be captured by one variable) that the writers intended.  The main objection to BWABB as far as I can tell was that the breach in continuity was way too severe and left undone at the end of the movie.  The ending to BWABB is easier to tolerate now that the movies are all out, but I imagine that BWABB would be way less popular than it is right now if ITWGY hadn't ended the way it did.
GalacticEntity

Crustacean
*
« Reply #73 on: 03-18-2009 22:26 »
« Last Edit on: 03-18-2009 23:04 »

For the tl;dr crowd:  just because a graph has ups and downs doesn't mean that there isn't a general trend in some specific direction.

That is true and I do not mean to imply that those are my thoughts, though reading my own post suggests just that.

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    OK, here's where we get to the meat of it.  First of all, as I recall, Lars isn't mentioned in any of the other movies.  Not even in IWGY, where Fry and Leela's relationship are revisited, so it seems to me that BWABB is getting the short stick just for being the first one not to mention him.  I think this further proves the somewhat flimsy continuity of the show that some see as reason enough to justify this criticism.  You can watch "The Sting" before "Time Keeps on Slippin'"  or  "The Why of Fry" before "Parasites Lost" and never know you saw it 'out-of-order'.  Plotting their relationship and seeing an actual progress can hardly be done.

I disagree pretty strongly with your assertion, both from actual experience (I happened to see some of the season 4 episodes, BBS and BWABB before the rest of the series) and on theoretical grounds.  "The Sting", "Love And Rocket", and a few other episodes would be completely out of place in Seasons 1 and 2.  Compare Fry's casual (to say the least) view of romantic relationships in "A Flight To Remember" and "Put Your Head On My Shoulder" to his attitude towards Leela in Season 4.  The difference is striking.

I don't see much of a problem with Lars not being mentioned at all in the later three movies.  Continuity is about characters remembering and growing from their experiences, not just about the writers inserting explicit callbacks to previous episodes.

Well, I cannot argue that I can replicate that experience you had, as I saw them mostly in order, but I can claify my statement.  I chose specific examples to support my claim, and did not intend for them to be thrown into eariler seasons.  Maybe that was a fault in my reasoning, and really, this whole part was more an afterthought.  There is definitely more progression than I gave it credit for, and I think my point was lost in the middle of this.  There are many stories in between the love ones where they are "normal" and BWABB is one of them.

I am not requesting for explicit callbacks nor do I think those are the mark of contunity.  But I don't see why you would hold BWABB accountable for dropping that continuity.  It seems like people just wanted to see more romance, and when they didn't get it in this movie, it's a valid critique, but not so much elsewhere.

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And as far as the progress of their relationship goes, we see something that we caught wind of in "Time Keeps on Slippin'".  Leela basically says that she likes Fry, but he would need to mature for her to love him.  His dedication to the holophonor in "The Devil's Hands Are Idle Play Things" was a step in the right direction.  Is it not reasonable to assume that both Fry and Leela realize that he has to mature (a la Lars) before she completely falls for him?

Okay, but I'm pretty sure Leela recognizes that Fry's already taken steps in that direction.  Also, the "progress" in their relationship isn't just about Fry trying to meet the standard that Leela has set; it's also about Leela gradually realizing that she isn't as bulletproof as she wishes she were, that she still carries deep emotional scars from her childhood, and that if there's someone who loves her for who she is and wants to help her heal, it's okay to let him in (cf. "Bicyclops Built For Two", "The Cyber House Rules", "Leela's Homeworld").

Umm, all true, but I never said anything to negate that.  The holophonor was just an example of Fry's evolution; there are more, but that doesn't (didn't) mean it was a done deal.

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She also confirms that there is nothing Fry can do to make her love him, so her word about never loving another like Lars can be seen as a characteristic of Leela (that has been confirmed by other characters and the creators/actors): when it comes to relationships, Leela is a mess.  For time issues, I don't think I need to list out that proof.

I don't follow your logic here at all.  Leela's statement in "Time Keeps On Slipping" takes place about 1-2 years before "Devil's Hands" and 6 years before BBS.  A lot changes during that time.

Given that Leela had been left at the altar four days previous, I wouldn't interpret her statement about Lars as any sort of strong evidence about Leela's character.  The main purpose of that statement, according to the DVD commentary, was to provide the audience one final clue as to Lars's true identity.  It is certainly a regression (not nearly as jarring as BWABB) to have Leela falling in love with a mysterious stranger at the beginning of BBS, but the only reason Leela and Lars got as far as they did was because Lars really was Fry and thus knew what it took to make Leela happy.

Fry's behavior in BBS is even more reliant upon history than Leela's.  Without it, Fry comes off as just a little snot who's acting petulantly because he isn't getting what he wants.  With it, his frustration and heartbreak is understandable (though he certainly is whinier than I'd prefer), and his attempt to give Leela up to Lars is a profound sacrifice.

I don't think the theortical time between episodes and movies can be taken into account.  The series is sequential, but charcter developments in between epsiodes and movies seems like a slippery slope that could justifly anything you wanted.  Also, between "Devil's Hand's" and BBS they were caught in a vortex and trapped in "reruns", as explained in the comic Futurama Returns. tongue

Leela's statement about Lars, from a character standpoint, was simply reinforcing what her character already was.  It wasn't anything new; Leela has felt sorry for Zapp, almost married Alcazar, was about to adopt a child with the doctor who gave her an eye, was seduced by Chaz's importance, and as far as she knew, almost married the guy that Fry wasn't.  Again, as the creators and actors have stated, she has problems in this area, along with the ones you mentioned earlier.  And to say that Lars' knowing how to make her happy being the reason she fell for him is a bit of a stretch.  That's like saying Leela had no choice but to love him.  As for this "regression", I don't see it.  I understand that's a little disjoint from "Devil's Hands", but it's like you guys are expecting them to change the Furuama formlua and suddenly adopt a new sense on continuity.

Concerning Fry's actions, I have nothing to say or add.  That is irrelevant to my mission; I'm here for BWABB's defence.

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Again, the writers and such have never had even two consecutive stories about them.  Maybe it's because I knew it wouldn't be continued (read it in an interview before BWABB was released), that I am able to easily overlook this.  And I'll defend the order of the movies as well because I think it's the Futurama way.  The love story is scattered in there, surrounded by the hilarious adventures the the Planet Express crew.

Perhaps I'm misinterpreting you, so please correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems to me that for you, "progress" has to be represented by a graph that is constantly moving in one direction, and I don't think that needs to be the case.  Like the stock market, Fry and Leela's relationship has had ups, downs, and periods of stasis, but I am pretty confident that there is a general upward trend that the writers intended.

I think the only misunderstanding we have here is what I'm trying "prove".  And you say is here: "Fry and Leela's relationship has had ups, downs, and periods of stasis".  That is what I meant to say, and really wish I had.  BWABB is one of those moments in stasis, and that its the expectation of it going up is what's hurting the opinion of the movie, instead of the movie itself.  Or so it seems.

Edit: And let me add that most of this post is debatable, but the parts I want to focus on are the ones about BWABB.  There's too much that can be said of the series, and I want to try zero in on this specific criticism of BWABB.
Curious Gorge

Bending Unit
***
« Reply #74 on: 03-18-2009 22:50 »
« Last Edit on: 03-18-2009 22:54 »

I admit that one of the reasons I dislike BWABB was because of the way it completely ignored the developments of BBS. It wasn't really because there wasn't any real romance in it as Bender's Game was enjoyable and that had none of the romance element at all but it was just jarring to see Fry and Leela act that way.

But as I said before, I'm willing to forgive wonky characterisation providing the movie is good as a whole but I really don't think BWABB was. I enjoyed the first half an hour or so in stages and it had me laughing but after that point it was just a downward slope and I found myself becoming increasingly bored.

I should probably give it another watch as whilst looking through my DVD's earlier today I realised that there's a fair number of parts that I just don't remember about it. Though on the other hand, if I got bored the first time there's little hope on second viewing.
speedracer
Bending Unit
***
« Reply #75 on: 03-18-2009 23:15 »
« Last Edit on: 03-19-2009 00:50 »

I think the only misunderstanding we have here is what I'm trying "prove".  And you say is here: "Fry and Leela's relationship has had ups, downs, and periods of stasis".  That is what I meant to say, and really wish I had.  BWABB is one of those moments in stasis, and that its the expectation of it going up is what's hurting the opinion of the movie, instead of the movie itself.  Or so it seems.

Edit: And let me add that most of this post is debatable, but the parts I want to focus on are the ones about BWABB.  There's too much that can be said of the series, and I want to try zero in on this specific criticism of BWABB.

To me, BWABB feels like a precipitous decline in the relationship, far bigger than any in the series, instead of a period of stasis/nondevelopment.  Fry spends the better portion of two seasons and the entirety of BBS pining for Leela, Leela presumably reaches a point where she might give Fry a chance, and then...it'd be one thing if they simply had an argument and things didn't take off, but what we get is a much bigger departure:  Fry is actively courting and considering living with some random chick he met in Times Square, Leela is for some reason okay with this, and Fry and Colleen's breakup leaves him completely depressed and is the main impetus for his journey into the anomaly.  After Yivo leaves, Leela is pissed off and it feels as if Fry has to start from scratch again.  It's fine if Fry and Leela aren't 100% committed to each other at the outset of BWABB, but I don't see why the writers had to pull them so far apart; it just didn't seem credible to me after I'd watched the entire series.

FWIW, I think BWABB is kind of funny on the whole (though not great), but I have to work pretty hard to suppress any memories of BBS and the later seasons of the show in order to watch it.  These are the reasons I found it more enjoyable the first time around, before I had plowed through the entire original series.
Tedward

Professor
*
« Reply #76 on: 03-19-2009 00:32 »
« Last Edit on: 03-19-2009 00:48 »

Lars isn't mentioned in any of the other movies.  Not even in IWGY, where Fry and Leela's relationship are revisited, so it seems to me that BWABB is getting the short stick just for being the first one not to mention him.  I think this further proves the somewhat flimsy continuity of the show that some see as reason enough to justify this criticism.

The problem with BWaBB in this regard is that it is, in a way, a direct continuation of BBS because the anomaly is still around (and although I'm glad they addressed this, where the story went with it turned out, at least to me, to be rather disappointing). Since they're continuing with this rip in space from BBS, it seems like the other major plot elements of BBS should still carry through as well (but I suppose the universe potentially being ripped apart is more important than the love between two characters...or is it?). It's also a bit irritating that they do somewhat comment on the strangeness of not continuing the Fry and Leela relationship at the end when Leela points out to Fry, "You forgot me quick enough when you met Colleen" and Fry brushes this off with "That's true" and moves on to Amy! This is a little funny but mostly just aggravating. If they could make fun of the flaw in continuing one BBS plotline but not another, then it seems that they could have been able to actually have an intriguing continuation of the Fry and Leela romance without having them be so incredibly distant with each other.

    A better way to fossilize him and keeping with the story was that duplicate Fry hadn't been in New York that whole time (anywhere else, really), and instead had only returned to Seymour, coincidentally, at his last minutes of life.  He stands to greet Fry, then Bender, still tracking him, fires and so on.

By the way, this is a great idea (It's a neat variation of Odysseus' faithful dog Argos from the Odyssey)! That would have been a very powerful moment in BBS and would have only added to the emotional aspect of Jurassic Bark.
GalacticEntity

Crustacean
*
« Reply #77 on: 03-19-2009 01:02 »
« Last Edit on: 03-19-2009 01:39 »

To me, BWABB feels like a precipitous decline in the relationship, far bigger than any in the series, instead of a period of stasis/nondevelopment.  Fry spends the better portion of two seasons and the entirety of BBS pining for Leela, Leela presumably reaches a point where she might give Fry a chance, and then...it'd be one thing if they simply had an argument and things didn't take off, but what we get is a much bigger departure:  Fry is actively courting and considering living with some random chick he met in Times Square, Leela is for some reason okay with this, and Fry and Colleen's breakup leaves him completely depressed and is the main impetus for his journey into the anomaly.  After Yivo leaves, Leela is pissed off and it feels as if Fry has to start from scratch again.  (Fortunately he didn't, as ITWGY reveals, but we don't know that at the time.)  It's fine if Fry and Leela aren't 100% committed to each other at the outset of BWABB, but I don't see why the writers had to pull them so far apart; it just didn't seem credible to me after I'd watched the entire series.

FWIW, I think BWABB is kind of funny on the whole (though not great), but I have to work pretty hard to suppress any memories of BBS and the later seasons of the show in order to watch it.  These are the reasons I found it more enjoyable the first time around, before I had plowed through the entire original series.

I think we've reached an impasse.  How big a departure BWABB actually was is related to how you feel about Fry and Leela's relationship in the series and BBS.  I clearly think less of it than you and many others, though there is no real way to measure it.  But if I'm underplaying it, you're definitely overplaying.

From where I'm standing, I count 9 episodes* in seasons 3 and 4  where their romance is a prominent part of the plot, out of 40.  And I think that's generous.  Their relationship has been all over the place; she has given him chances, and they have acted like nothing was going on all before.  The only way I could see them taking a step back is actively disliking each other, and that doesn't happen.  So I'm going to file that under stasis.  Fry's depression can also be argued to the point where it's a matter of interpretation, so I won't go there.

Having to suppress memories to enjoy something seems an awful to go about it.  Maybe it'd be better if you saw the whole thing my way.  wink


The problem with BWaBB in this regard is that it is, in a way, a direct continuation of BBS because the anomaly is still around (and although I'm glad they addressed this, where the story went with it turned out, at least to me, to be rather disappointing). Since they're continuing with this rip in space from BBS, it seems like the other major plot elements of BBS should still carry through as well (but I suppose the universe potentially being ripped apart is more important than the love between two characters...or is it?). It's also a bit irritating that they do somewhat comment on the strangeness of not continuing the Fry and Leela relationship at the end when Leela points out to Fry, "You forgot me quick enough when you met Colleen" and Fry brushes this off with "That's true" and moves on to Amy! This is a little funny but mostly just aggravating. If they could make fun of the flaw in continuing one BBS plotline but not another, then it seems that they could have been able to actually have an intriguing continuation of the Fry and Leela romance without having them be so incredibly distant with each other.

This I think backs up my new conclusion.  You wanted and expected to see the relationship continued, and when it didn't happen, you were a bit aggravated.  It's my feeling that it didn't need to happen, despite the anomaly.  I hope I didn't generalize you too much.

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By the way, this is a great idea (It's a neat variation of Odysseus' faithful dog Argos from the Odyssey)! That would have been a very powerful moment in BBS and would have only added to the emotional aspect of Jurassic Bark.

Thanks!  You know, I've been a fan of Greek Mythology and the like for a long time, and I'm currently taking a class on it as well, and I totally forgot about that!  I just read that chapter and I have a test on it next week, so I guess I need to get studying.

---

*The list (I hope I didn't miss any, and I do understand the somewhat frivolousness of such a list and just looking at the numbers.)

Parasites Lost
The Cyber House Rules
Time Keeps on Slippin'
Love and Rocket
Teenage Mutant Leela's Hurdles
The Why of Fry
The Sting
The Farnsworth Parabox
The Devil's Hands Are Idle Playthings
FistfulOAwesome

Starship Captain
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« Reply #78 on: 03-19-2009 03:20 »
« Last Edit on: 06-01-2009 16:57 »

GalacticEntity: Since the above posters already covered reasons shippers (or at least continuity freaks) had a problem with BWABB I'll cover your question about OOC moments in that movie.

First, I'll state that while I am a shipper I had no problem with the middle movies not advancing Fry and Leela's relationship. When I heard there would be 4 movies I knew the 1st and 4th would be epic while the 2nd and 3rd would be side-stories and I had no problem with that. Fry and Leela's story is a part of Futurama but it is not the only part (or even the best (that sounded worse than I meant it to be)).

Fry dating Colleen was not OOC whatsoever. I and probably many people had no problem with it. Many have said already that since the universe was "ending" and Leela wasn't receptive it completely made sense for Fry to hook up with some chick and those many were right. It also helped that Colleen was a funny character (and well played by Brittany Murphy). I do feel the writers misused  her and I'll get back to her later.

Edit: You know, Maybe this is OOC after all. I think I just liked Colleen too much to see it. BBS is a pretty big moment for the F/L relationship so it's strange that Fry would be dating this other chick directly afterwards or that F/L didn't seem to have any talks about what they just found out. We wouldn't have to see the talks and a relationship wouldn't have to come out of it but it be nice if some mention had been made about what happened in that ending (and not mocking like the writers did).

Fry dumping this universe for the one beyond the rift is completely OOC. Any way you spin it his decision makes no sense. Fry didn't know Colleen well enough to truly be saddened by their break-up. If it was a series episode Fry would have brushed it off. Fry wasn't sad about being dumped by any of his other girlfriends and Colleen had about as much characterization as any of them. Replace Colleen with any of the girls Fry dated in the series and the absurdity of his decision is even more obvious.

If you try and say it was a final straw along with the fact that Leela didn't get with him after BBS it still doesn't make sense. Sure, it makes more sense than him doing it just because of Colleen but It was never mentioned in the movie and even Fry isn't stupid enough to think that he could simply slide into Lars place. Lars was a different man, similar in many ways to Fry but different in that he had eight more years of life experience than Fry did. He had wooed Leela and truly made her happy. To think that Fry wouldn't realize that Leela wouldn't need some time to cope with his death is monumentally stupid, even for Fry. It stands that the only reason Fry went through the rift is that the plot demanded it.

Nobody else has mentioned (I did read though the BWABB thread) what I think is truly the most OOC moment in the film (and the one that really made me dislike it), Leela attempts to kill Fry. How does this even begin to make sense? At first it seems simple: Fry is under control of a mysterious alien creature who has broken though Earth's defenses and has started bonding with every creature on the planet. Leela figures the man talking to her is no longer Fry and thus she should kill him and save herself. But there are so many logical leaps taken with this that it ends up making no sense.

First, Fry and Leela have been friends for 8 years. Disregard all the shippy episodes and you still have 8 years of friendship where they have constantly escaped danger at each others sides and have done tremendous acts for each other (For example, Fry doesn't need to be in love with Leela to want to find out the truth about her past and subsequently stop her from unknowingly killing her parents). Were the writers telling me that eight years of close friendship is met with 3 ray guns to the face (a joke I saw coming and didn't find funny (much like the second half of the movie))!

Second, it's not like Fry was completely under control. He knew their names and was not threatening them whatsoever. Clearly she would have known that that was still Fry in their somewhere. She is locked in a building with two of the smartest men on the planet. Why wouldn't she have waited for them to come up with a solution to the tentacle problem and free their friend?

Third, she saw several people being attached to the creature on her run to PE. Are they going to have to be killed too? Considering this is happening all over Earth that's a hell of a lot of the population that is going to have to be exterminated!

Fry attaching a tentacle to Colleen is an OOC moment. Fry has Colleen brought to him. Why wasn't she already attached from the initial attack or after getting captured? If Fry under the control of the creature is trying to "spread the love" why would he deny her love for any amount of time? This means that Fry was intentionally holding off the creature so he could attach her himself. Notice the way that Fry attaches her. She is scared out of her mind and he sinisterly attaches her to something she didn't want to be attached to. Maybe I'm overreacting but that moment is sickening to me.

Amy sleeping with Zapp is somewhat OOC. While I understand that Amy is distraught over their current situation and Zapp was playing with her emotions it still seems strange that she would so quickly have sex with him only days after her husbands death. This is especially strange since Zapp was the man Kif hated the most and she knew that.

The entire universe was acting OOC in the final chapter. So this creature forcefully jams its apparent testicles in their necks and they want to marry it! I really don't feel this needs comment.

Leela was OOC again at the end. She clearly doesn't like the creature and yet at the end she professes a love for it! Some people claim that she was just choosing the better of two existences between living with the entire biological universe within the creature or living with the robots on Earth. If that were true then why is she still in love after Bender rescues them?

There are so many things wrong with this movie that I could fill up pages with my problems. Instead I'll just fill up a long paragraph. Why was Kif killed? After he was brought back it didn't affect his relationship with Amy in the slightest (if BWABB is taken out (I take it out) then his line in ITWGY just means he misses her because he hasn't seen her in a while) and the way he was brought back was so lame (the commentary of The Sting stated that the Honey on the Couch resurrection was a joke on how a lesser Sci-Fi series would have brought back Fry. Makes sense that a lesser Futurama plot would do the same). If the Creature could break though the Diamond shield then why didn't it break through the lesser iron shield of the PE building? Why did it only attach a tentacle to Amy and Zapp in the cabin? It should have easily been able to get Leela as well. Even with the broken tentacle it still should have been able to get her. After Leela shoved Fry out of the way to reveal the creatures secrets why didn't it take that chance to shove a tentacle in her before she revealed the news? How did Fry manage to send Bender his letter? Don't tell me he threw it or asked the creature to throw it (since the creature instituted a no contact with other universes policy). Were the mutants captured as well. I doubt Leela would want to go back to Earth if her parents were attached (and considering the tentacle that came out of the toilet that means it is in the sewers too and would have attached). The League of Robots was kind of a waste. Bender didn't need to be the leader of the League of Robots in order to request the Robot Devil's Army of the Damned. Colleen was a wasted character. She got good use in Chapter 1 but was randomly thrust into the rest of the movie. She only appeared for like 2 minutes top in every other chapter to the point that when she appeared in the ending I said to myself "Oh Yeah. She exists.".

Edit (May 1, 2009): For the purpose of discussion I am able to let my dislike of BWABB go. If I or anyone else links to this list ignore the forthcoming paragraph. I was in a bad mood from being reminded of Beast (note: I dislike all the movies except for ITWGY) and I lashed out.

I'm done. I don't want to type any more about how much I don't like this movie. Just like with the Star Wars prequels and Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull, as far as I'm concerned none of this happened. Tell me it did and I'll shove my fingers in my ear and say "Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah".
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Near Death Star Inhabitant
Urban Legend
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« Reply #79 on: 03-19-2009 03:40 »

You have a lot of time on your hands.
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