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duff77
Poppler
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Well, okay--it's true some of us judge the movies too harshly because of our affinity for the show. But I think some of what we're seeing in these movies is reminiscent of season 4 of the series, when there were just a lot of small, really weird, non-sequitor kind of moments that didn't make sense and (to me at least) weren't very funny.
For instance, I'm thinking of the moment (the episode is escaping me just now) when the the professor goes into a ten-second flying hands "woo-woo" thing that ends with him saying "safe." Some people, I'm sure, laughed out loud at that. I just thought it was strange and stupid and pointless. The people who feel like me are probably the ones having more of a problem with these movies. Like season four, there's a bunch of stuff that's just suddenly there, very odd, and not very well connected to anything else.
I could forgive it in Bender's Big Score because everything ultimately came together in a very interesting way--though it was hard for me to appreciate it until I saw it the second time. The problem with Beast with a Billion Backs isn't just that it's one sudden and ridiculous plot line after another, it's that none of it really comes together in any kind of cohesive way.
And am I the only one who's incredibly disappointed to discover that nothing more interesting than a big ugly tentacle alien was waiting behind that big rip in the universe? After all the very interesting space-time stuff in Bender's Big Score, with the time code coming from the God-like device in Godfellas... In concept, at least, it was classic Futurama--in the mode of episodes like Roswell that Ends Well and The Why of Fry. I could only assume it was a set-up for something meaningful and interesting, which are two words that have always been as important to this show as funny. I find it distressing that after so much effort was made to set this movie up, nothing occurred of any consequence whatsoever.
Which is almost beside the point. The main problem with Billion Backs is that the central plot line is ridiculous and emotionally uninteresting. Adding a myriad of disconnected subplots didn't help anything. It was funnier than the first one, and the jokes were in more of the traditional, snappy Futurama style--but as far as concept and quality of story telling go, it stunk.
And I still love this series, and I will buy the next two DVDs no matter what.
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Frida Waterfall
Professor
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Originally posted by duff77: The main problem with Billion Backs is that the central plot line is ridiculous and emotionally uninteresting. Adding a myriad of disconnected subplots didn't help anything. It was funnier than the first one, and the jokes were in more of the traditional, snappy Futurama style--but as far as concept and quality of story telling go, it stunk. "Bender's Big Score" wasn't really as emotional that it is made out to be. Sure, there's emotion, but to my perspective, the emotion presented in the film isn't really something to be emotional about. "Bender's Big Score" was made out to be the extraordinaire(sp?) return to the series. When we left off, Fry and Leela seemed to be closer than friends. All of a sudden, "Bender's Big Score" comes back claiming that two years have passed and there is absolutely no acknowledgement to their relationship prior to the cancellation. No where in the first part (in the entire movie for the most part) did Fry show any hint that he truly possessed some deep feelings for Leela. All he did was go on about " I've loved Leela since the day I've came to the future." when usually he doesn't go on about that for so long. When Lars came into the picture, Leela didn't really seem like she was that in love with him. There was that scene in the museum, but it was only emotional in the sense that Lars was once the desperate Fry. There was one line I was extremely irritated by as a shipper, and that line was when Lars just stopped the Xmas tree bomb from exploding and Leela just bursts out and says "Oh Lars! This makes me love you even more!". Leela wasn't Leela in her personality. We've seen her in love, and she doesn't act so bland and robotic quite like that. The entire Leelu the narwhal plot was only important to Lars, and it was a storyline that they could've done without. And I've stated this before, at the end when Fry has his "epiphany" on Leela and Lars, he really shouldn't learn anything new on relationships when finding out that Lars was his time paradox-duplicate. To keep it short, the only emotion you really got out of the film was from Lars because he was once the desperate Fry. During my first viewings of the film, I was actually crying not because Fry has a chance with Leela now (which I still don't really see how they tried to get that message across in this movie), but I was much more upset that they'd kill off Fry canonically. Fry is a lovable character at heart, yet I just thought it was plain cruel to kill of any form of him. As far as storyline goes for "Bender's Big Score", it wasn't as epic as it could've been. Just to recap my thoughts in previous threads, "Bender's Big Score" was only as big as Earth, as only the Earthlings were effected by the scammers. For a Futurama movie, that's still pretty small. "The Beast with a Billion Backs" was a multi-universal plot, as it affected two universes. Now that was a plot worth an entire movie. Also, since "Bender's Big Score" used time travel heavily in the plotline, you'd expect something bigger beyond just a time paradox-duplicate and a rip to another universe. Onto subplots of the two movies- "Bender's Big Score" was crowded with too many subplots. In fact, I can't recognize the main stream plotline probably because it wasn't big enough. "The Beast with a Billion Backs" had a definite main plotline that was created by some large subplots merging together in the second part. Yes, the League of Robots was silly, unecessary and all, but it wasn't as bad as not being able to pinpoint the major plot in any of "Bender's Big Score"'s sub-plots. Uggh... my thoughts may be a bit unorganized... Originally posted by duff77: And I still love this series, and I will buy the next two DVDs no matter what. I think that goes for all fans. Just because the first two movies were sour, doesn't mean that there's no chance for the other two. Besides, how else is the show going to get renewed beyond the movies?
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ALequalsGREAT
Starship Captain
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Originally posted by duff77: But I think some of what we're seeing in these movies is reminiscent of season 4 of the series, when there were just a lot of small, really weird, non-sequitor kind of moments that didn't make sense and (to me at least) weren't very funny. I think that is a great point, although I am of the camp that generally finds them humorous; I thought of the phenomenon as the writers reaching a certain comfort level with the characters. I agree that the movies did not execute those sorts of jokes nearly as well as the series. For example, I didn't buy Bender's amped-up persona in BWABB nearly as much as I had in such episodes as "Pharaoh" (that "awkward meter" joke at the Rubok annoyed the hell out of me). Originally posted by Frida Waterfall: ..when Lars just stopped the Xmas tree bomb from exploding and Leela just bursts out and says "Oh Lars! This makes me love you even more!".Leela wasn't Leela in her personality. We've seen her in love, and she doesn't act so bland and robotic quite like that. I thought the reason was to serve the larger joke; it happens right after a song where the entire crew is lamenting how awful their lives are, and also Lars proposing. That sort of joke is pretty common, it seems the writers love to use it ("Think things are the worst now? Well, how about this!" ). I laughed even as I felt terrible for Fry. As a side thought- we saw a different side of Leela in BBS, one that I prefer to shippily believe was truly in love. She is the other, after all Originally posted by Frida Waterfall: The entire Leelu the narwhal plot was only important to Lars, and it was a storyline that they could've done without. The Leelu plot may have been a bit long-winded but it gave me a considerable amount of information about the main character. I enjoyed seeing Fry mature, and it made the Fry-to-Lars personality transition more plausible. Originally posted by Frida Waterfall: ...at the end when Fry has his "epiphany" on Leela and Lars, he really shouldn't learn anything new on relationships when finding out that Lars was his time paradox-duplicate. I agree. Fry learned a lot about himself with that epiphany and thus takes another step toward becoming Leela's ideal man (maybe I should put this in the Ship thread ) Originally posted by duff77: The main problem with Billion Backs [...] Pretty much. It was more entertainment and less depth than BBS.
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Frisco17
DOOP Secretary
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Simply put, they're both good but in two different ways.
One thing I don't get is that alot of people seem to not like the Bender sub-plot in BWABB. I thought it was great and a good foil for the rather bizzare main plot.
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Frisco17
DOOP Secretary
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Maybe they reproduce differently in their swarm stage.
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Xanfor
DOOP Secretary
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Um... To reproduce?
When has it been suggested that they don't need gender?
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km73
Space Pope
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Originally posted by bobbot: I think that part of a lot of the problems that people are having with these 4 episode movies is the level of compromise that has to be met in order to make them into four equal parts. I must digress at this point so please bear with me. We arre trying to judge the movies as though they were intended to be stand alone films with completed plot lines and stories. I keep hearing that a lot, but I just don't see it. That's not really my problem with the movies. 22 minutes, 90 minutes or 300 minutes, they could have been great no matter what length if they simply were anything like the show's episodes. Often when I first used to watch the eps, I would find myself wishing that they would go on a lot longer; develop the storyline more. Just a very few random examples of ones that could've gone a lot more into depth or been lengthier would be Farnsworth Parabox, IITM, TDTESS, PYHOMS, obviously Devil's Hands, etc. The problems or grievances I had with the movies was simply that they weren't funny enough, they didn't really make me "feel" anything for the most part, and the writers were far too transparently trying to cater to - well, I've never been exactly sure to who really, since I just honestly don't see how anyone who was a serious fan of the series could actually think that these two films have been anywhere close. Maybe I'm just too critical, but that's been pretty much how I've felt the whole time. Yes, the quality of the series presented a lot to live up to, but they could have done far, far better.
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ALequalsGREAT
Starship Captain
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Originally posted by bobbot: I think that part of a lot of the problems that people are having with these 4 episode movies is the level of compromise that has to be met in order to make them into four equal parts...We are trying to judge the movies as though they were intended to be stand alone films with completed plot lines and stories...I believe that we are seeing a season of episodes in four installments not a Futurama movie with 3 sequels. if this is the case we should see some of the unended and altered story lines start to coalesce into some order in the next film and find most of them wrapped up by the time we get to the end of The Wild Green Yonder.
I originally wanted to approach the movies as one big story with convergence at the finish, but have since been dissuaded from that line of thinking after reading this DXC interview. See the third question/answer @km Let us not forget, for these movies they are churning out material at a rate of 1 ep/2 weeks, in addition to a 60%-70% new writing staff so I am not surprised that the quality is less. It makes me sad.
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Frisco17
DOOP Secretary
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I think people have just built the original episodes up in their minds to the level of perfection. Against that backdrop everything looks like crap. Same thing happened with Star Wars, Indiana Jones and pretty much everything else that's been reborn like that.
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ZombieJesus
Lost Belgian
DOOP Secretary
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Okay, this film was 20 kinds of complicated. Also: Ring a bell? Beksinski. Google the dude.
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Ralph Snart
Agent Provocateur
Near Death Star Inhabitant
DOOP Secretary
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Originally posted by Tammie88:
I thought it was a bit better than BBS, even though I'm normally into the Fry/Leela shipper stuff it wasn't as well done as it usually is. I'd give BBS a 7 and BWABB a 8.5 Wow, a post from a person who has been a member since 2003 and has only 18 posts to her account. BWABB's must be really special to deserve a post.
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Frisco17
DOOP Secretary
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It's sad that I haven't found time to watch it with the commentary until tonight. It's been out for almost a month already.
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Godfella
Crustacean
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I agree with Frisco17 completely. Some are better, some are worse. Just like anything else you could sit here and pull them all apart piece by piece, but given the fact its a science fiction cartoon most things seem to be pretty coherent. To say that you regret buying the movies is blasphemous! Only in the Futurama world could they do the things they do. Maybe on Bender's ship at the end of BWABB he has the professors shrink ray from "Parasites Lost - 3ACV02" to help make all the people fit? Instead of criticizing, why not use your imagination (like the writers do) and make something up. It would be great if they could make the movies long enough to explain everything in the Futurama universe, but time is the problem. Something has to be cut at some stage. (Although there are still another two movies to go!) Going from writing 20 minute episodes to doing feature length epic's they have all taken a big step, and I think it has paid off. All in all I'm glad that Futurama is back (Baby!)
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OddFlame
Crustacean
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I must also add that I was quite disappointed by the second movie. The first movie was decent, but not great. The second was just lame.
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YazFoxxy
Crustacean
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I agree. I thought the Bender's Big Score was much more of a story than The Beast with a billion backs.
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