Should Futurama discuss 9/11, if the show was renewed?

[Reply #40 on:]

It may not be upseting to you people over there in Europe, but think about how America feels about it. Over 10000 poeple died and/or were injured, and I think was related to my family, and besides, why wouldn't they talk about it? And as for Fry...he wasn't even there to witness the towers being attacked, so why would he care.
  If you ask me, it's a horrible tradgegy, and I should stop talking about it.

[Reply #41 on:]

I agree with DoTheBartman, Futurama have done plenty of social commentar allready. "A Head In The Polls" and "Bender Should Not Be Allowed On TV" readily spring to mind. The commentary is more directed at general trends and the basics of our society, rather than specific events. 1) It's funnier and 2) it has more of an impact. I mean it could've been so easy to make That Guy the CEO of Enron, but they made him a generic 80's yuppie guy.

As for the original question, no they shouldn't "discuss" November 9th September 11th, for the same reasons they wont "discuss" the 1972 Olympics terror act, the UVF/IRA civil war, the Rome/Vienna Airport attacks, the Lockerbie bombing, the wave of airplane hijacks in the 70's and other terror acts; it's not funny and would seem out of place.

We've lived with terrorism for generations, chances are people 1000 years from now will live with it too.

[Reply #42 on:]

I know this is offtopic, but I think
 

Teral's Sig

This post is brought to you by the PEEL Old Guard - Crushing hopes since 2002.

looks awful familiar...

I am either very paranoid or very flattered.  Thank you Teral (or in case it's the first one, thank you weed.)

[Reply #43 on:]

PCC Fred mentioned the PEEL Old Guard in the AFF thread at one point. I can't exactly remember which one of you inspired the sig, so I guess you can take joint credit. Since I've been hated by several posters (none of which are active on PEEL anymore) for thinking new petitions are futile, how could I resist? 

And we knew about the Star Trek connection, we had high hopes of copying the Trekkers' succes. Some even sugested we contacted Bjo Trimble (who spearheaded the Star Trek campaign in the 60's) to get hints and ideas.

Okay, [/tangent]

[Reply #44 on:]

How about we ask the reverse question:
Why does it need to be brought up in Futurama, TV serieses, films or any form of media entertainment?

Answer, it doesn't. Since when did terrorism have any role to play in entertainment?

[Reply #45 on:]

9/11 is an event in history, and Hollywood likes to do is make TV shows and movies based on it.

Titanic, Pearl Harbor, WWII, Vietnam, JFK getting shot, the list goes on.

All these were tragic events and are dealt with in movies and TV shows.  9/11 is another tragic event.  South Park had the guts to discuss 9/11 just eight weeks after the event.  It has been three years.  There was terrorism before 9/11 and what's to say that there won't be terrorism in the years to come?

I think an episode where Fry learns about the events of 9/11 and perhaps what became of his family during that event would be another tearjerking and touching episode.

[Reply #46 on:]

 

Originally posted by aslate:
Since when did terrorism have any role to play in entertainment?

Two words - Patriot Games.

As for 9/11, in just over 100 years' time it'll be as much a page in a history book as the American Civil War or Waterloo.  Okay, it'll have added resonance because video footage will exist, but to the people of the 2100s, never mind the 31st century, it'll be something from the long distant past.

Some years ago my grandad was angry when he heard that a large %age of schoolchildren didn't know who the British Prime Minister was during WW2.  My dad asked him who the British Prime Minister was during the Boer War (a Brits-Africans was that took place about 20 years before my grandad was born), and my grandad admitted that he didn't know.

To use one of my favourite Picard quotes:

"Let the dead rest, let the past remain the past"

[Reply #47 on:]

 

Originally posted by fryfanSpyOrama:
9/11 is an event in history, and like Hollywood likes to do is make TV shows and movies based on it.

Titanic, Pearl Harbor, WWII, Vietnam, JFK getting shot, the list goes on.

And all of those were hilarious!  All of those topics are chock full of humor, too, and should be brought up in a science fiction cartoon show.

FFSoR...you seem to be the only person who has this crazy notion that a dead show should somehow reference something that happened thousands of years ago in canon time, and three years ago IRL.  Now, maybe it's just me, but 9/11 is still not an issue other shows talk about.

Oh, and South Park's treatment of 9/11?  If you noticed, you'll realize that the show never joked on the WTC.  It villified Bin Laden (as it should), and it made fun of the round-the-clock "we have no news but must report something" news.  The WTC was not mentioned.

[Reply #48 on:]

I agree with aslate, evan and possibly many others more.
A Sci-Fi cartoon show, happening in the distant future, filled with mostly funny plots, isn't really a place to discuss terrorism that happened in real life 3 years ago.

Beside: didn't Fox and Matt Groening react to 9-11 in 2001?

 

Written in an article TLL posted here:
In response to the events of the September 11, 2001 attacks against the United States the Fox Television Network and Futurama creator Matt Groening for a short time removed the scene in the show's opening in which the Planet Express ship crashes into a giant television screen. It was felt that this scene would be upsetting and be disturbing to many viewers who had witnessed the head on collision of an airplane into the World Trade Center in New York on live television. Within a month or so after the attacks the scene was reinserted back into the opening.

[Reply #49 on:]

 

Originally posted by Venus:
why the hell would people in the year 3004 give a damn about something that happened in 2001? especially given the fact that aliens have destroyed the entire civilization of earth several times over. It would be like me caring or even remembering something that happened back in 1004.

Precisely. Things like:
"In the 11th century A.D., the Byzantine emperor Constantine IX, judging females too great a threat to spiritual life, signed a charter barring them from crossing the boundaries of Mount Athos, an enclave dotted with 20 monasteries. Even the donkeys that serve as the only mode of transport on the steep, rocky slopes of this Aegean peninsula must be males."
Interesting but outdated and not of much interst these days.
Besides the fact that nobody in the Futurama universe a thousand years from now learned any of their past correctly to begin with. Only Fry would know, and he disappeared from out time before 9/11 happened.

[Reply #50 on:]

It is to sad yo talk about.

[Reply #51 on:]

 

Originally posted by fryfanSpyOrama:
I think an episode where Fry learns about the events of 9/11 and perhaps what became of his family during that event would be another tearjerking and touching episode.

Ewww, I can't think of a worse idea for a Futurama episode. There's a big difference between a comedic tear jerker such as "Jurassic Bark" and one based on some event Fry didn't even witness.  In fact, it would be down right trite for this to be a topic on Futurama.  I have a lot of respect for the writers of Futurama, so I'm confident this wouldn't even be considered by them.  There's too many other funny stories to be told.

[Reply #52 on:]

 

Originally posted by fryfanSpyOrama:
9/11 is an event in history, and like Hollywood likes to do is make TV shows and movies based on it.

You know, people are always saying things like "We will never forget"...why the hell would we want to remember? If we plan on moving on, we can't dwell on the bad things that have happened to us. We have to go kick some towelhead ass and then forget about this stupid shit already. Living in the past is lame in terms of something like a terrorist attack.

Overly patriotic people piss me off. I like my country, but hell.

[Reply #53 on:]

If you're so convinced it would work Fryfan write a fic and prove it. But i still stand by my belief that a wtc themed Futurama story would be lame beyond all reason. I read those fics you mentioned. i didn't hate them because i thought they crossed some sort of line, i hated them because they sucked.

[Reply #54 on:]

Funny, you should mention that, Venus.  I was planning on doing a SpyOrama involving a terrorist like attack.  It would involve SCAM and Zarahordians.

Zarahordian1: Excuse, Scam Commander, I don't have a problem with you strapping us with bombs, but the blast won't stain our clothes?  These clothes are the lastest fashion.

Zarahordian2: Yeah, I just bought this shirt yesterday.

Scam Commander: Don't worry, we've rigged the bombs to wipe out everything, leaving nothing to be stained.

Zarahordian1: Good cause have you've priced dry cleaning, lately?

       

Originally posted by TheLampIncident:
 You know, people are always saying things like "We will never forget"...why the hell would we want to remember? If we plan on moving on, we can't dwell on the bad things that have happened to us. We have to go kick some towelhead ass and then forget about this stupid shit already. Living in the past is lame in terms of something like a terrorist attack.

Overly patriotic people piss me off. I like my country, but hell.

I'm not one of those overly patriotic people, I'm just one of those people who wants to be entertained with these movies and learn that what I've watched actually happened.

     

Originally posted by bankrupt:
 Ewww, I can't think of a worse idea for a Futurama episode. There's a big difference between a comedic tear jerker such as "Jurassic Bark" and one based on some event Fry didn't even witness.  In fact, it would be down right trite for this to be a topic on Futurama.  I have a lot of respect for the writers of Futurama, so I'm confident this wouldn't even be considered by them.  There's too many other funny stories to be told.

Actually, upon thinking twice about it, you are right.  How about the episode be to 9/11, like how episode WITHW is to Vietnam War?  Also, my friends says WITHW is similar to the Iraqi War, even though it aired before that event happened.

   

[Reply #55 on:]

 

Originally posted by fryfanSpyOrama
How about the episode be to 9/11, like how episode WITHW is to Vietnam War.

Yeah...while I am only about 95% appalled by this, it might be better to wait three or four decades or so before doing a comedy version.  Better yet, wait for a whole series to be a commentary on it like M*A*S*H* did and then parody that, which was probably where the idea for WITHW came from.

Most Americans wouldn't want to compare 9/11 to Vietnam.  I mean, one was a war...the pointless deaths were all soldiers.  The other one was the worst terrorist attack in our county's history.  Fewer deaths, but most of them civilian.

Your Spy-O-Rama scene though...that sounds ok.  I personally have no problem with ridiculing suicide bombers in general, as that has to be the dumbest form of protest in the history of civilization.

Oh, and WITHW resembles the Iraq conflict because Iraq resembles Vietnam.

I'm trying to keep a calm tone, because I think a lot of my countrymen are going to absolutely flame you.  Just being reasonable...

[Reply #56 on:]

   

Originally posted by germanfryfan:
I agree with aslate, evan and possibly many others more.
A Sci-Fi cartoon show, happening in the distant future, filled with mostly funny plots, isn't really a place to discuss terrorism that happened in real life 3 years ago.

Beside: didn't Fox and Matt Groening react to 9-11 in 2001?

Sci-fi is always providing social commentary for the what the real world is dealing with or as dealt with.

Planet of the Apes (1968) was set in long after the year 3000, and yet dealt with Vietnam, the McCarthy Era and racism.  It provides a warning sense that if we don't learn from the past, we are doomed to repeat it. Science fiction has always been a perfect way to discuss an issue, without actually attacking the issue.  Maybe, Futurama won't have to directly mention 9/11, but it could do something like what Planet of the Apes did.

Futurama has done a few things that remind people of 9/11.

Remember in RTEW, the PE ships attacks an army base, Roswell in 1947.  This episode aired in late fall 2001, after 9/11.  Also the scene where the Planet Express ship launches that missle with the writing, "Roswell That Ends Well", is similar to the American soldiers who wrote Patriotic things on the missiles that were used on Afghanistan. 

I love the episode, but I was surprised that noone had a problem with an American Army base being blown up and mentioned the similarities on what was happening in the real world.  That shows me that we can be entertained and not trip about what we are actually seeing.  Which one of the reasons why I love Futurama.

 

Originally posted by Nerd-o-rama:
 Yeah...while I am only about 95% appalled by this, it might be better to wait three or four decades or so before doing a comedy version.  Better yet, wait for a whole series to be a commentary on it like M*A*S*H* did and then parody that, which was probably where the idea for WITHW came from.

Thus proves that Americans don't have a problem discussing something that is occuring at that particular time.  I don't mention parodying 9/11, I never said that, I said mention it is some way.

 

Most Americans wouldn't want to compare 9/11 to Vietnam.  I mean, one was a war...the pointless deaths were all soldiers.  The other one was the worst terrorist attack in our county's history.  Fewer deaths, but most of them civilian.

You could compare 9/11 with Pearl Harbor, since both events proved that America is capable of being attacked by a foreign enemy. 

[Reply #57 on:]

 

Originally posted by fryfanSpyOrama
I was surprised that noone had a problem with an American Army base being blown up and mentioned the similarities on what was happening in the real world

'Cause it was the 40's.  The writing on bombs thing started (as far as I know) in World War II and has become a military tradition.

I just think 9/11 is too specific and recent a thing to do commentary on.  The ensuing "War on Terror," though technically more recent, would be a better mark for parody as it is more generic and most of the world doesn't seem to like how America is handling it, including much of America.
Well, there's the setup for your next fic.  By the way, when can we expect "The Bot With the Golden Chip" on TLZ?

[Reply #58 on:]

   

Originally posted by Nerd-o-rama:
 'Cause it was the 40's.  The writing on bombs thing started (as far as I know) in World War II and has become a military tradition.

I just think 9/11 is too specific and recent a thing to do commentary on.  The ensuing "War on Terror," though technically more recent, would be a better mark for parody as it is more generic and most of the world doesn't seem to like how America is handling it, including much of America.
Well, there's the setup for your next fic.  By the way, when can we expect "The Bot With the Golden Chip" on TLZ?

However, you see my point on how parallel both similarities are.

   

Your Spy-O-Rama scene though...that sounds ok.  I personally have no problem with ridiculing suicide bombers in general, as that has to be the dumbest form of protest in the history of civilization.

Thank you for your positive opinion about my SpyOrama idea.  SpyOrama is sort of my way of providing social commentary.  College is preventing me from completing that fanfic, it won't have that scene of the Zarahordians, though.

[Reply #59 on:]

 

Also the scene where the Planet Express ship launches that missle with the writing, "Roswell That Ends Well", is similar to the American soldiers who wrote Patriotic things on just about every missile or bomb throughout modern military history.

You see, FFSO, these are more example's of general references, not speicific world events (well, the Zoidberg picture is based on a real one, but I digress).

If the show has reminded you of the WTC attacks, it was never by design of the producers, just your own connections. As the commentaries pointed out, they made a conscious effort to avoid doing that. If the attack on the US army base reminds you of 11/9 (that's right! I'm going to do it the proper way!) , then so will the majority of 'When Aliens Attack', good chunk of "A Taste of Freedom" etc. Futurama's real world references are is best when they don't try to use an actual event for some cheap pathos. I would lose immense respect for the show.

I can watch an explosion and not complain about how it reminded me of Hiroshima.

[Reply #60 on:]

I understand that this is a coincidence, but I'm amazed by that.  If people don't see those similaries, then that's okay.  I just wanted to point that out. 

As far as the writing on missile in RTEW.  I was aware that has been done in American history before, but the War in Afghanistan was the most current thing at the time and that was the first thing that popped in my head with I saw the writing on the missile.


I like the idea of Futurama using general references, that can be related to many current things because that shows how universal the show is and how long Futurama can last and entertain future fans with the social commentary it has to offer.

[Reply #61 on:]

OF COURSE we see the bloody similarites, you moron. I'm just saying that there's no reason to suddenly think:
"What? Spaceship shooting at US soldiers? Arrrgh! Real life parallels, too close to the bone, it's all coming back! The Horror! THE HORROR!"
To draw every scene of violence back to one particular event is a sad, stilted way to view a the enteretainment industry.

You have no support for this idea. There's a reason.

[Reply #62 on:]

You don't have to use names, you moron.  I was merely pointing something out.  Hell, RTEW could have a million different things that people could bring up.

And if you still don't understand what I said, then you don't understand what one of the main elements of science fiction.  Science fiction offers either an escapism or social commentary of just about anything.  And sometimes it could have many different meanings.

I'm not trying to be mean, but you shouldn't get mad, like that.

[Reply #63 on:]

I know that Sci-Fi can (and often, IS), used to provide social commentary on modern day phenomina. The ideas you've proposed, that of directly reference the WTC attacks, are foolish, for the reason mentioned in the numerous posts in this thread. But instead of realising that this no-one is going to agree with you, you try to draw parralells with you idea to earlier events in the show, using the flimsiest of connections to try to prove that the show not only could have reminded people of the terrorist attacks, but that it's a long standing tradition of commenting on actual real world events. While, it's true, the show does drop the odd piece of real-world commentary into our laps, that's a good distance away from your suggestion of a 11/9 themed episode. You're stubborn refusal to accept that you've failed is what annoys me, as well your contuned, flailing attempts to justify your point. I AM trying to be mean, because I'm trying to get you to wake up. It's the open-handed slap to the babbling lunatic.

[Reply #64 on:]

Let me get this straight, your name is slackjawedmoron and you are calling me a lunatic?  [laughs out loud]

I never said they were direct references, I said they were just similar.  That's a big difference.

[Reply #65 on:]

Perhaps what you should be asking is, when will they make a Hollywood Film about 9/11? 

it really is just a matter of time.  Personally i think it will be a shit film if they do because it will over use american flags and be far too patriotic that it'll miss the point entirely of what 9/11 means. 

Perhaps a better film would be to take the view point of the highjackers, but that would end up being 'hypocritically' branded as foriegn propaganda, no differnt to the any Hollywood film with american propaganda.

[Reply #66 on:]

It could (and probably will) happen. Just as long as they don't turn it into some love-triangle crap-fest ala Pearl Harbour.

And I don't think that there's anyway it wouldn't be waving the flag as hard as it could.

[Reply #67 on:]

I would love to see a movie that discusses 9/11, since I've seen many documentaries about 9/11 and thought they were well informative.  However, I'm afraid Hollywood will screw it up.  Add a fictional love story and totally change a few things around, ala Titanic and Pearl Harbor.

[Reply #68 on:]

 

Originally posted by FFSo:
I love the episode, but I was surprised that noone had a problem with an American Army base being blown up and mentioned the similarities on what was happening in the real world. That shows me that we can be entertained and not trip about what we are actually seeing. Which one of the reasons why I love Futurama.

The main reason nobody complained about that was because it was shot in a jokey fashion (side scrolling) and nobody appeared to die or scrape their knees.
Frankly, people wanting exploding buildings taken off television because it reminds them of 9/11 is just stupid.
The idea of Futurama referencing 9/11 has no point. If it were to focus on actual issues that can be related to 9/11, like media portrayal, eye-for-an-eye scenarios are alright, as long as they are done in a subtle and not blatantly obvious way.

[Reply #69 on:]

Like I said before, I said they were similar, not a direct reference.  But I do agree with you Mole, I think it is stupid to pull stuff off the air, because of what it reminds people of

FOX edited episodes of Family Guy which have the Twin Towers.  Also, in Road to Rhode Island, they cut one of my favorite scenes, Stewie tries to board a plane armed with a backpack full of weapons. He gets by the x-ray technicians by distracting them with On the Good Ship Lollypop. Once past them he mutters "Let's hope Osama Bin Laden doesn't know show tunes." And we see Bin Laden singing as he sneaks weapons pass the x-ray.  That scene isn't even on the DVD, for what I've heard.

[Reply #70 on:]

 

Originally posted by FFso:
FOX edited episodes of Family Guy which have the Twin Towers. Also, in Road to Rhode Island, they cut one of my favorite scenes, Stewie tries to board a plane armed with a backpack full of weapons. He gets by the x-ray technicians by distracting them with On the Good Ship Lollypop. Once past them he mutters "Let's hope Osama Bin Laden doesn't know show tunes." And we see Bin Laden singing as he sneaks weapons pass the x-ray. That scene isn't even on the DVD, for what I've heard.

That is one of the four Family Guy episodes I've seen in my life. It was on my friends computer and it kept those scenes in, too.

[Reply #71 on:]

 

Originally posted by Nerd-o-rama:
 Yeah...while I am only about 95% appalled by this, it might be better to wait three or four decades or so before doing a comedy version.  Better yet, wait for a whole series to be a commentary on it like M*A*S*H* did and then parody that, which was probably where the idea for WITHW came from.

I hate to nitpick, but you guys do know that M*A*S*H was about the Korean War, not Vietnam, right?  I mean, I guess you could say that it was a social commentary on Vietnam, but it would probably be more accurate to say that it was a social commentary on war in general.

[Reply #72 on:]

Wait, was this whole topic a subtle way for you to justify a scene in your fic you were unsure about? Cause if it was, i so knew it.

[Reply #73 on:]

I know this is a little off-topic, but I just want to correct a few things said in here about South Park...

 

Originally posted by Nibblonian:
I never personally saw, nor cared about, South Park, but I know at one point Cartman chases down Saddam or Bin Laden and says he is 'envious.'

Actually, Cartman called Bin Laden a "prick" and ended up killing him Bugs Bunny-style. As for Saddam... he's one of the show's biggest targets. Just watch the movie - he is portrayed as an insane sex addict in a homosexual relationship with Satan. In the end, Cartman ends up electricuting Saddam to death. South Park has certainly shown no respect to either Saddam or Bin Laden whatsoever.

Perhaps you are getting this confused with Hitler? Cartman has dressed up as Hitler on 2 occassions (once in a Halloween episode, although he didn't actually know what the hell he was doing then, and again when he misinterpreted The Passion Of The Christ as being a pro-nazi and anti-jewish film). Still, I don't recall him ever claiming to be "envious" of any dictator at all...

 

Originally posted by fryfanSpyOrama:
South Park had the guts to discuss 9/11 just eight weeks after the event.

Actually, Matt Stone & Trey Parker always insert provocative material into South Park, but even THEY had the good taste not to discuss 9/11 eight weeks after the event. In the episode you are thinking of (509: Osama Bin Laden Has Farty Pants), 9/11 was not directly mentioned whatsoever. In fact - the closest thing in that episode to a 9/11 reference is the line "Sharron? You've been watching CNN for about 8 weeks now". That episode focused solely on the Afghanistan war, and had no commentary on 9/11 at all.

However, since then - there have been a few 9/11 references in the show, although they were more-or-less parodies aimed at things that happened because of that event, rather than the event itself. Such as in episode 612 - A Ladder To Heaven, with Alan Jackson (he got VERY rich off a 9/11 tribute song), when they portrayed him as some asshole who just kept making songs about recent happenings to get money. One of the descriptions of him in that episode even says "he's back once again to capitalize on people's emotions". Still, they haven't shown any disrespect to the tragedy of 9/11 in that show yet, and I doubt they ever will.

Basically, my point is that South Park is a show that has a lot of focus on modern events - and if a show like THAT hasn't directly discussed 9/11, why should a science fiction parody set 1000 years from now discuss it?

[Reply #74 on:]

 

Originally posted by David A
I hate to nitpick, but you guys do know that M*A*S*H was about the Korean War, not Vietnam, right?

Yes, it's set in Korea, but it is clearly social commentary on the futility of war in general and specifically the Vietnam War which inspired the show in the first place.  In fact, the original movie contains absolutely no mention of the word "Korea."  The writers intended viewers to make the connection to Vietnam.

[Reply #75 on:]

FFSO, I understand what you are trying to say that Sci-Fi is uses the future settings to discuss social commentaries of the present times. I think that some topics don't need to be discussed in Sci-Fi shows.

9/11 is one topic that for the last couple years has never left the general media. I hate what happened that day and feel bad for those who lost family that day; but it seems there hasn't been a day that has gone by where the news or something doesn't mention 9/11. I just want to move on and hope that the soldiers currently in "The Middle East" catch those who involved in making 9/11 happen.

BTW... Great points Beamer.

[Reply #76 on:]

   

Let me get this straight, your name is slackjawedmoron and you are calling me a lunatic? [laughs out loud]

Let me get this straight, you think my username actually reflects my opinion of myself, and also, how I would like to be viewed by others?

Damn, time for a revision of my own sense of self-worth.

In any case, great points, Beamer. Can this topic be layed to rest now? We don't really need another episode of FryFan vs the world.

[Reply #77 on:]

I think the real questions:
Should Futurama parody or devote an episode to 9/11?
and
Should a Futurama episode make any reference to 9/11?
The answer to he first: not a good idea.
The answer to the second: not a bad idea.

[Reply #78 on:]

Since it is set in the year 3000+ it would be odd if it were to discuss what to them is ancient history. Since Fry was frozen before the events it wouldn't be something he'd think about, old New York was destroyed by aliens so he would presumably think the towers went then too.

If a show set in the present decided to have the incident as part of its story line I’d have no problem, there have been plenty of shows about real terrorist acts. That said I think any comedy dealing with a terrible event were there are still survivors or people who lost somebody the event need to be handled very carefully.

[Reply #79 on:]

 

Originally posted by aslate:
How about we ask the reverse question:
Why does it need to be brought up in Futurama, TV serieses, films or any form of media entertainment?

Answer, it doesn't. Since when did terrorism have any role to play in entertainment?

Damnit, i shouldn't have added that last line. Why should Futurama discuss 11/9? It shouldn't. Any links would be too direct, too recent and would not be funny.

Why should 11/9 be constantly used/mentioned? It's been over-done.